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#64952 - 12 Nov 07 17:40 Raising ire
riccardo Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 12 Oct 05
Posts: 2195
Loc: Jakarta
As Oscar Wilde once said: "There is only one thing in life worse than being talked about, and that is not being talked about."

Our own Roy's Hair raised the ire of some dimwit enough that he/she wrote a Letter to the Editor. Moral of the story, if you want to get a rise out of parochial nationalists you need to do 2 things:

1. Be a foreigner
2. Suggest that their government improve in some way

-------------------------------------------------------

Foreign refugees

I'd like to comment on (Roy's Hair's) article Indonesistan, (The Jakarta Post, Nov. 4).

He wrote, "It's a shame that the Indonesian government seems to view [foreign refugees in Indonesia] as a burden and won't grant them the opportunity to stay and work here legally...".

I think he should do more research before making such comments. Why blame it on the Indonesian government? Had he asked the UNHCR and/or IOM for updates and facts?

Those Afghan (and Iraqi) refugees do not want to be Indonesians. They want to go to Australia (or any other country but Indonesia).

I remember that was their demand when they staged a strike and sewed up their lips in Mataram (and also Makassar) several years ago.

It's good enough the Indonesian government provides proper shelters for them. They thanked our government for that, while saying sorry that Indonesia is not the place they want to be.

They understand Indonesia already has lots of problems to be solved and they don't want to be part of this country.

You know, if the Indonesian government wishes to, why not kick the refugees out of this country? Why do we even bother giving them a place to stay?

The Indonesian government can do nothing but have the goodwill (and perhaps a "sense of brotherhood") to let them stay because there is no other country -- that the refugees want -- willing to receive them. The UNHCR (or IOM) is too slow to solve the problem.

UMMI KALTSUM
Jakarta


_________________________
Just here proffering my pearls to swine, my throat to wolves and my trousers to the flagpole.

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#64953 - 12 Nov 07 17:47 Re: Raising ire [Re: riccardo]
Dilli Offline
Pujangga Besar

Registered: 26 Feb 06
Posts: 8044
Loc: Nearest Bar
Umm, Err.

"Those Afghan (and Iraqi) refugees do not want to be Indonesians. They want to go to Australia (or any other country but Indonesia).

I remember that was their demand when they staged a strike and sewed up their lips in Mataram (and also Makassar) several years ago."

More facts pleas!

_________________________
Menace to Sobriety


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#64959 - 12 Nov 07 20:55 Re: Raising ire [Re: Dilli]
kenyeung Moderator Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 16 Apr 07
Posts: 2374
Loc: Indonesia
Them's the facts. Fair comment on Roy's Hair's piece. You don't see Australia or the US rolling out the red carpet for boatloads of Middle Eastern asylum seekers. It reminds of the time Oscar Wilde tried to flee to Australia to escape trial for gross indecency, only to be abandoned by an unscrupulous bunch of sailors in Jakarta. In protest, he sewed his lips shut and vowed to hunt down Basil Brush. This prompted his famous quip: "Fox-hunting is something that can't talk, chasing something that can't eat."

Protesting asylum seekers sew mouths shut
JAKARTA, 11 August 2004 - At least 40 Afghan asylum seekers in Bogor, south of Jakarta, have commenced a hunger strike, with several of them reportedly sewing their mouths shut, to protest the United Nationsí refusal to grant them refugee status. "They are frustrated. But the United Nations has given them an exceptional hearing. The Afghans have been given every possible consideration," Steve Cook, head of the Jakarta office of the International Office for Migration, was quoted as saying Tuesday (10/8/04) by the Associated Press.
He said at least 14 of the hunger strikers had sewn up their mouths, adding the group has been living for more than two years in a hostel in Bogor. Itís not the first time such a protest has been staged in Indonesia. Three Afghan asylum seekers on Lombok island, West Nusa Tenggara province, sewed up their lips in January 2004 after the UN High Commissioner for Refugees (UNHCR) ruled they were ineligible for asylum in a third country.
A similar hunger strike was carried out last year by Afghan asylum seekers on neighboring Sumbawa island. The hunger strikes ended after the Afghans were hospitalized. More than 100 asylum seekers from Afghanistan, Iraq and Iran, have been living on Lombok for over two years. All of them have been denied refugee status by the UNHCR, preventing them from entering Australia, New Zealand or other third countries as political asylum seekers.
Indonesia is a key transit point for asylum seekers attempting to reach Australia, much to the annoyance of the Australian government, which in the past complained that Jakarta wasnít doing enough to curb the flow of illegal immigrants. In October 2001, a boat carrying more than 400 asylum seekers, mostly Iraqis and Afghans, sank in Indonesian waters while en route to Australia. At least 374 people drowned, including 150 children.
Australia and Indonesia have since held several conferences on people-smuggling in an effort to boost cooperation to combat the problem. Many Middle Eastern asylum seekers paid thousands of dollars to people smugglers for passage to Australia or New Zealand, only to be dumped in Indonesia. Most of them refuse to return to their countries of origin, claiming they could be killed because of their political affiliations.

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#64967 - 13 Nov 07 10:47 Re: Raising ire [Re: kenyeung]
Roy's Hair Offline
Pujangga Besar

Registered: 08 Nov 06
Posts: 3974
Loc: jakarta
It was the "Unspeakable in pursuit of the unedible" I believe.

Fair comment. I know these chaps don't want to be here and I said that in me piece. The point is they ARE here and are pretty much stuck here and have been for 6 years. I'm just saying they could be given citizenship and allowed to work. There's not that many of them and there don't seem to any more on the way. Of course in Oz they'd be in one of Howard's Outback Gulags as I called them.
_________________________
Chinese like more traditional patterns on their ring.

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#64982 - 13 Nov 07 17:02 Re: Raising ire [Re: Roy's Hair]
kenyeung Moderator Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 16 Apr 07
Posts: 2374
Loc: Indonesia
Quoting: Roy's hair
It was the "Unspeakable in pursuit of the unedible" I believe.


Pshaw! Call yourself a bloody closet Morrissey fan, eh?

"The English country gentleman galloping after a fox - The unspeakable in full pursuit of the uneatable."
From the aptly titled 'A Woman of No Importance'.

As for raising ire, Wilde coming from Riccardo's mouth is quite vulgar and most unbecoming.

"Fox-huntin? Aint that somethin that can't talk, chasin somethin that can't eat?"

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#64983 - 13 Nov 07 17:11 Re: Raising ire [Re: kenyeung]
KuKuKaChu Moderator Offline
Pooh Bah

Registered: 09 Oct 05
Posts: 10790
Loc: Centre of the Universe
stop teasing the americans! or i'll report you to The Administrator!
_________________________
KuKuKaChu: dangerously too sophisticated

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#64985 - 13 Nov 07 18:10 Re: Raising ire [Re: KuKuKaChu]
Roy's Hair Offline
Pujangga Besar

Registered: 08 Nov 06
Posts: 3974
Loc: jakarta
The Importance of Being Riccardo. A five act drama marinated in irony, fried in bathos and served up with a wry smile and the American college football scores.
_________________________
Chinese like more traditional patterns on their ring.

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#64988 - 13 Nov 07 18:34 Re: Raising ire [Re: Roy's Hair]
kenyeung Moderator Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 16 Apr 07
Posts: 2374
Loc: Indonesia
As Saki (Hector Hugh Munro) once said: "He is one of those people who would be enormously improved by death."

Our own kenyeung raised the ire of some dimwit enough that he/she wrote an angry message. Moral of the story, if you want to get a rise out of the trousers of parochial aardvarks you need to do 2 things:

1. Be a twat, posing as a somdomite.
2. Suggest that they take a dose of their own medicine.
3. Wank yourself stupid to online porn.

As for that fuckin travesty of a "play" mentioned by my own Roy's Hair, there is no such thing as a moral or an immoral play. Plays are either good or dumb. Or shite.

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#64991 - 13 Nov 07 20:14 Re: Raising ire [Re: kenyeung]
naga Offline
Member++

Registered: 18 Jan 07
Posts: 260
Loc: undisclosed location
our local friend has a good point, the govt should NOT be burdened with these oxygen thieves either way, its just that the Indonesian govt is more incompetent in the way it treats it refugees with disdain.....

and for the record, Heil Howard!!!!!!!!!
_________________________
"Keep on rockin' in the free world"

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#65011 - 14 Nov 07 09:57 Re: Raising ire [Re: naga]
Roy's Hair Offline
Pujangga Besar

Registered: 08 Nov 06
Posts: 3974
Loc: jakarta
Oh dear I got another letter about it in today's Post. I kind of stand by my original thoughts. Indonesia doesn't have a problem though with leaving people in stateless limbo for the rest of their lives re:ethnic chinese (or Cina Banteng (sp?)). It's not as if refugees are flocking to RI every day is it? This country's refugees are largely internal ones of it's own making.Surely if they were allowed to be citizens after 6 years then they wouldn't be costing the govt. anymore and would have to take their chances with the other plebian rakyats. Perhaps the authorities are afraid they'll queer up the local populace though.


Edited by Roy's hair (14 Nov 07 09:59)
_________________________
Chinese like more traditional patterns on their ring.

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#65015 - 14 Nov 07 10:17 Re: Raising ire [Re: Roy's Hair]
KuKuKaChu Moderator Offline
Pooh Bah

Registered: 09 Oct 05
Posts: 10790
Loc: Centre of the Universe
you've stirred up some (mild-mannered) hornets for some reason. your comments were not especially controversial as far as i am concerned. but against the backdrop of the indigenous xenophobia, and hypocrisy in relation to australia's position on refugees, perhaps we should not be surprised at these comments.

nonetheless, i am not a supporter of multiculturalism. people should have the right to determine who is allowed to become part of their societies, regardless of the often racist underpinnings of such determinations.
_________________________
KuKuKaChu: dangerously too sophisticated

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#65027 - 14 Nov 07 15:52 Re: Raising ire [Re: KuKuKaChu]
Roy's Hair Offline
Pujangga Besar

Registered: 08 Nov 06
Posts: 3974
Loc: jakarta
I'd agree with that in general, it's just this idea of Muslim Brotherhood (whatever happened to the sisterhood??) that people bang on about here when talking about Palestine, the Iraq war etc. but when push comes to shove they don't want to know.
_________________________
Chinese like more traditional patterns on their ring.

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#65028 - 14 Nov 07 15:56 Re: Raising ire [Re: Roy's Hair]
KuKuKaChu Moderator Offline
Pooh Bah

Registered: 09 Oct 05
Posts: 10790
Loc: Centre of the Universe
Here's the second letter to The Jakarta Post about Simon's article:

More on foreign refugees

Simon Pitchforth sounds so noble when writing about Afghan refugees in Indonesia, (The Jakarta Post, Nov. 4, p. 5.)

Please bear in mind that Java is a very densely populated island because Indonesia is one of the most populated countries in this world after all and therefore has a very high unemployment rate.

We are still a third world country. Refugees who are paid a monthly pittance of Rp 500,000 (US$54.95) should be grateful because a great number of Indonesians do not even have that much to live on.

Simon, why don't you try to get these people into your own country? Start processing their documentation now. Despite Indonesia's gigantic economic, financial and social problems, we are indeed noble to allow not only Muslim refugees into our own country.

Even Catholic refugees from Timor Leste have fled into Indonesia's West Timor and are still residing there. A great number of Buddhist Vietnamese are still living here, they fled the Vietnam war and now Buddhists from Myanmar are seeking refuge.

We do not discriminate, Simon, and we are grateful to the UNHCR that this organization exists to help us out. It is so easy to criticize others when you forget to look into the mirror.

LYNNA VAN DER ZEE-OEHMKE
Bogor, West Java
_________________________
KuKuKaChu: dangerously too sophisticated

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#65035 - 14 Nov 07 16:07 Re: Raising ire [Re: KuKuKaChu]
Roy's Hair Offline
Pujangga Besar

Registered: 08 Nov 06
Posts: 3974
Loc: jakarta
Quoting: KuKuKaChu


We do not discriminate, Simon, and we are grateful to the UNHCR that this organization exists to help us out. It is so easy to criticize others when you forget to look into the mirror.

LYNNA VAN DER ZEE-OEHMKE
Bogor, West Java


Do not discriminate? That's a laugh. And what mirror is this she's talking about? I'm not a fuckin' spokesman for the UK home office. How come I'm the hypocrite then? The sad racism of this country is rearing it's head again. Presumably, with a name like that this woman is herself an immigrant here (or at least her family is). Humbug.


Edited by Roy's hair (14 Nov 07 16:09)
_________________________
Chinese like more traditional patterns on their ring.

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#65039 - 14 Nov 07 16:38 Re: Raising ire [Re: Roy's Hair]
kenyeung Moderator Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 16 Apr 07
Posts: 2374
Loc: Indonesia
In the fifth century BC, the Greek historian Herodotus described modernity as a demigod who mutters angrily at us, demanding that we entertain fantasy in place of dull rigid fact. Nevertheless, this ancient Greek was known as the father of history; his accounts of the wars between the Greeks and Persians are the first known examples of historical writing (485-425 BC). How do you respond to Herodotus?

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#65040 - 14 Nov 07 16:51 Re: Raising ire [Re: kenyeung]
Roy's Hair Offline
Pujangga Besar

Registered: 08 Nov 06
Posts: 3974
Loc: jakarta
Herodotus? Shove it.

(From "The Horn" Comp: P.Cook D.Moore)
_________________________
Chinese like more traditional patterns on their ring.

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#65042 - 14 Nov 07 16:59 Re: Raising ire [Re: Roy's Hair]
kenyeung Moderator Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 16 Apr 07
Posts: 2374
Loc: Indonesia
Leviathan? Was he, was he a jakchatter?

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#65043 - 14 Nov 07 17:02 Re: Raising ire [Re: kenyeung]
Roy's Hair Offline
Pujangga Besar

Registered: 08 Nov 06
Posts: 3974
Loc: jakarta
I dunno but he gives me the 'orn
_________________________
Chinese like more traditional patterns on their ring.

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#65045 - 14 Nov 07 17:32 Re: Raising ire [Re: Roy's Hair]
kenyeung Moderator Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 16 Apr 07
Posts: 2374
Loc: Indonesia
Middle Eastern immigrants give me the horn. Reading The Jakarta Post gives me the horn too.

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#65048 - 14 Nov 07 17:50 Re: Raising ire [Re: kenyeung]
Roy's Hair Offline
Pujangga Besar

Registered: 08 Nov 06
Posts: 3974
Loc: jakarta
I'll tell you who gives me the 'orn. That Chris Lambert. I think it's the way he does his hair.
_________________________
Chinese like more traditional patterns on their ring.

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#65051 - 14 Nov 07 18:28 Re: Raising ire [Re: Roy's Hair]
kenyeung Moderator Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 16 Apr 07
Posts: 2374
Loc: Indonesia
Oh yeah, you've picked a favorite of mine there. If there's one thing Lambert's got, it's hair. I remember this one time I was round at Lambert's house, and I, er - I went into the bathroom for a piss, and I saw a comb by the basin - with little bits of his hair in it. I couldn't prevent myself, you know, having a wank immediately cos that hair looked, it looked so vulnerable.


Edited by kenyeung (14 Nov 07 18:29)
Edit Reason: the horn

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#65052 - 14 Nov 07 18:57 Re: Raising ire [Re: kenyeung]
Roy's Hair Offline
Pujangga Besar

Registered: 08 Nov 06
Posts: 3974
Loc: jakarta
You see your sexually attracted by Lambert's hair. I can understand that. That Van Z. Report, that gives me the horn, Wild Zeroes, they give me the horn, it all does.
_________________________
Chinese like more traditional patterns on their ring.

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#65058 - 14 Nov 07 19:22 Re: Raising ire [Re: Roy's Hair]
Dilli Offline
Pujangga Besar

Registered: 26 Feb 06
Posts: 8044
Loc: Nearest Bar
Oh dear, they've started off again
_________________________
Menace to Sobriety


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#65065 - 14 Nov 07 19:45 Re: Raising ire [Re: Dilli]
kenyeung Moderator Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 16 Apr 07
Posts: 2374
Loc: Indonesia
Another thing that gives me the horn is Susilo Bambang Yudhoyono. I don't half fancy that little bulge in his trousers. I wrote him a love letter telling him how I felt. And, you know, I thought I'd put it bluntly. "Dear Pak SBY", I didn't call him 'Mas Bangers', I wasn't familiar. I said, "Dear Pak SBY. You give me the fucking horn and I want to know what you, as leader of the Indonesian government, plan to do about it." You know, ah, I was expecting a reasoned reply of some kind. And what'd I get? A fucking letter come back, saying: "Pak SBY has read your enquiry with interest but it will not be part of his official policy, though we are sympathetic to your cause." Well, in my view he hadn't even read the fucking thing.

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#65066 - 14 Nov 07 19:47 Re: Raising ire [Re: kenyeung]
Dilli Offline
Pujangga Besar

Registered: 26 Feb 06
Posts: 8044
Loc: Nearest Bar
Perhaps he was intimidated by your protests of affection and did not want to offend "you know who"...I believe we only got part one of that story!
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Menace to Sobriety


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