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#46180 - 28 Feb 07 11:13 East Timor -RI issues
riccardo Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 12 Oct 05
Posts: 2195
Loc: Jakarta
Two recent significant things happened in East Timor this week.

1.. Jose Ramos-Horta (current PM and Nobel Laureate) announced he'd run for President this April, and he's a HUGE favorite.

2.. Ramos-Horta literally ordered the Indonesian Military (TNI) to "do their job" and stop assisting Timorese rebels by letting them flee across the border. He also appeared to be strongly implying here that he believes the TNI (or "rogue elements" within it) have been provoking and assisting the rebels since last May.


This is the same Ramos-Horta, who in September 1999 said in response to a suggestion that Timor would not survive without Indonesia. "One does not have to be an Einstein to do slightly better than those incompetent, lazy, corrupt bastards who managed our country for 23 years. Sometimes I find it laughable that the Indonesians keep telling us East Timor cannot manage itself without Indonesia." (Asiaweek, Sept. 24, 1999)


It could be quite possible that these diplomatic niceties over the last few years and the love-fest between Xanana and SBY, with all the talk about peace and friendship commissions and forgiveness over justice, could soon end with Ramos-Horta in power. Could get verrrrry interesting indeed.
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Just here proffering my pearls to swine, my throat to wolves and my trousers to the flagpole.

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#46185 - 28 Feb 07 12:21 Re: East Timor -RI issues [Re: riccardo]
KuKuKaChu Moderator Offline
Pooh Bah

Registered: 09 Oct 05
Posts: 10790
Loc: Centre of the Universe
a nation-state "has no eternal enemies and no eternal friends, only eternal interests."
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#46198 - 28 Feb 07 14:11 Re: East Timor -RI issues [Re: KuKuKaChu]
riccardo Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 12 Oct 05
Posts: 2195
Loc: Jakarta
A sad example of Indonesian sentiment - and intense brainwashing - in regard to the East Timor issue.

---------------------------------------------
The Jakarta Post:
Thursday, October 14, 1999

Belo's article biased


I was disgusted by the article written by Bishop Carlos Filipe Ximenes Belo, "Why the world owes my people" (Newsweek, Oct. 4, 1999). Almost all the stories told by Belo were total lies and extremely biased.

* Indonesia did not invade East Timor in 1975. The Indonesian Army entered East Timor on the invitation of the warring factions to help restore order and curtail the civil war there, which erupted after the Portuguese left the island. That was the first time the Timorese breathed the air of freedom in East Timor, after more than 450 years under the yoke of the wicked Portuguese rule.

* It is not true that 200,000 people were killed in East Timor.

* The Indonesian Army saved the Timorese by allowing them safe-passage to the Indonesian territory of Kupang after violence erupted following the Aug. 30 ballot there. These people are now given a free choice either to return to East Timor or stay in Indonesia. Their return to East Timor is in progress now, with people being transported by plane from Kupang to Dili.

* The Army Special Forces (Kopassus) was not in East Timor.

* The Indonesian Military never obstructed relief operations in East Timor, but rather they fully supported them.

* The killing of Sander Thoenes and Indonesian journalist Agus were the full responsibility of Major Gen. Peter Cosgrove and his Australian troops.

* Bishop Belo now seems to love the Timorese. Where was he and what did he do to help the Timorese when they were under Portuguese rule?

* When the Timorese were freed by the Indonesians in 1974/1975, they were no more than coolies and East Timor was extremely underdeveloped.

* It is the Indonesian people who helped them become human beings in the true sense of the word. It was Indonesia which gave freedom to them. No nation in the world can deny this.

Finally, I would like to mention that nearly all of Newsweek's news reports and stories regarding East Timor were unfair toward the Indonesian government, the Indonesian people and the Indonesian Army in particular. I wonder what kind of code of conduct they practice. I have been subscribing to Newsweek for nearly a year now, but all of its stories about my country are biased and degrading.

MUHAMMAD RAMZY HASIBUAN
Jakarta
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Just here proffering my pearls to swine, my throat to wolves and my trousers to the flagpole.

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#46203 - 28 Feb 07 22:59 Re: East Timor -RI issues [Re: riccardo]
KuKuKaChu Moderator Offline
Pooh Bah

Registered: 09 Oct 05
Posts: 10790
Loc: Centre of the Universe
well, it was 1999. indonesians were still wiping the New Order sleep from their eyes.

i'm sure they've moved on since then ...
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#46208 - 01 Mar 07 00:01 Re: East Timor -RI issues [Re: KuKuKaChu]
riccardo Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 12 Oct 05
Posts: 2195
Loc: Jakarta
Quite True Kuku, and emotions were running very high at that particular juncture in history. Nonetheless, I think it'd be interesting to do a survey on those bulleted points he makes, and ask people which version they believe today?

Do most Indonesians believe the version they were fed for 25 years, OR the version that Nobel Laureate Belo and the rest of the world's citizens understand to be the truth?

I really think that this is THE KEY to good future relations. If the majority of the populace (i.e. voters) still believe the lies, then that will have an enormous affect on policy matters at the highest levels between these two new democracies.
_________________________
Just here proffering my pearls to swine, my throat to wolves and my trousers to the flagpole.

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#46210 - 01 Mar 07 00:22 Re: East Timor -RI issues [Re: riccardo]
doremi Offline
Member+++

Registered: 17 Jan 07
Posts: 488
Loc: slouch couch
Rewriting history...similar thing happened with Japan and other countries.

quote:
Thousands of Chinese rioted in Beijing last weekend. The reason: their belief that Japan's role in World War II was whitewashed in new Japanese school text books. The U.S., Germany and France, among other countries, have also struggled with re-telling their history.

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#46226 - 01 Mar 07 02:00 Re: East Timor -RI issues [Re: doremi]
riccardo Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 12 Oct 05
Posts: 2195
Loc: Jakarta
Indeed, NW, it happens all the time, but two WRONGS (or 5 or 6) don't make a RIGHT.

However, the difference is how countries deal with it and rectify it, truthfully, over time. There does not seem to be an effort to rectify those things here. I still would like to do a good survey on current understanding/sentiment in Indonesia about their recent history in ET.

I've recently finished a couple of books on the subject, the Ali Alatas book, "pebble in the shoe" and a 1997 book by Hendro Subroto called "Eyewitness to Integration [sic] of East Timor" --- both were quite shocking, to say the least. I've heard that school textbooks here still have not been changed, even though such changes were being "discussed" a few years ago.
_________________________
Just here proffering my pearls to swine, my throat to wolves and my trousers to the flagpole.

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#46251 - 01 Mar 07 05:27 Re: East Timor -RI issues [Re: riccardo]
riccardo Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 12 Oct 05
Posts: 2195
Loc: Jakarta
* Indonesia did not invade East Timor in 1975. The Indonesian Army entered East Timor on the invitation of the warring factions to help restore order and curtail the civil war there, which erupted after the Portuguese left the island. That was the first time the Timorese breathed the air of freedom in East Timor, after more than 450 years under the yoke of the wicked Portuguese rule.

* It is not true that 200,000 people were killed in East Timor.

* The Indonesian Army saved the Timorese
* The Army Special Forces (Kopassus) was not in East Timor.

* When the Timorese were freed by the Indonesians in 1974/1975, they were no more than coolies and East Timor was extremely underdeveloped.

* It is the Indonesian people who helped them become human beings in the true sense of the word. It was Indonesia which gave freedom to them. No nation in the world can deny this.



MUHAMMAD R. H.
Jakarta
_________________________
Just here proffering my pearls to swine, my throat to wolves and my trousers to the flagpole.

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