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#85394 - 03 Sep 08 06:32 Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali
KuKuKaChu Moderator Offline
Pooh Bah

Registered: 09 Oct 05
Posts: 10790
Loc: Centre of the Universe
Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine alias Lawrence Bellefonte alias Captain Lawrence is a Canadian-born con-man, now living in Bali. He runs an outfit called PT Bali Affordable Lifestyles International that has been selling "villas" and real estate on that island for some years. He has ripped off a *lot* of people, not just here in Indonesia, but in the US as well. Read on:


From http://the.honoluluadvertiser.com/article/2007/Apr/16/ln/FP704160348.html

Accused swindler living it up in Bali

By Rick Daysog
Advertiser Staff Writer


Barry Bellefontaine in 1993.


“Lawrence” Bellefontaine’s photo from a real estate Web site.


Wilbert Ho and Carol Comeau weren't pleased to learn that Barry Bellefontaine, a Honolulu investment adviser who took their money and skipped town nearly 12 years ago, is now selling luxury homes in Bali, Indonesia, and serving as president of the local tennis club.

After Bellefontaine and his wife sailed off in a 50-foot-yacht in July 1995, his investment company went belly-up, owing $4.2 million to Ho, Comeau and about 90 other investors and creditors.

In the late 1980s and early 1990s, the 56-year-old native of Canada was a significant player in Hawai'i's investment community.

Through investment seminars, newspaper advertisements and his weekly radio shows, Bellefontaine's company, Asian American Corp., bought and sold rare coins and precious metals for scores of loyal customers. Many of those customers were retirees who had entrusted Bellefontaine to hold the coins they bought.

Bellefontaine once boasted that his company handled more than $40 million in business from its start-up in 1985 to its eventual shutdown in 1995. His newspaper ads also claimed that his investment advice generated average returns of 50 percent or more in less than a year.

But for investors such as Ho and Comeau, those returns were a sham.

Ho said he lost tens of thousands of dollars after he purchased more than a dozen rare silver coins from Bellefontaine, who told him he could resell the coins for double Ho's original investment. Ho said he handed over the coins to Bellefontaine, who disappeared before returning the coins or repaying him.

"I'm bitter about that investment, and I'd like to get my money back," Ho said. "I would settle for half of it."

Comeau also entrusted her money with Bellefontaine. The Downtown resident, who met Bellefontaine at one of his Waikiki investment seminars, said she initially made money on gold coins she purchased from Asian American.

But Comeau said she gave Bellefontaine a $13,000 coin for safekeeping when he disappeared.

"That was a fair amount of money for me," she said.

Since leaving Hawai'i, Bellefontaine has started a new life in Bali, where he sells real estate and goes by the name Lawrence Bellefontaine.

According to his company's Web site, Bellefontaine "sailed to Bali 10 years ago with his wife ... on their yacht" and is now one of Bali's largest real estate brokers and developers.

His company, PT Bali Affordable Lifestyles International, said its clients include several multi-millionaires, senior officials with the U.S. and Australian consulates and several hotel executives.

PT Bali's Web site also notes that Bellefontaine is a frequent speaker at investment seminars and is the president of a local tennis club that caters to foreigners in Bali.

The Web site makes no mention of Bellefontaine's past in Hawai'i, his background in rare coin investments nor of his past legal woes here.

Reached at his home in Bali, Bellefontaine declined to discuss his time in Hawai'i and the reasons he left the Islands.

He referred all questions to his attorney. Peter Howell, the lawyer who represented Bellefontaine in the past, could not be reached for comment.

"I prefer not to talk to you. The last time I talked to you guys it made a lot of problems for me," Bellefontaine said before hanging up his phone.

James DiGeorgia, editor of the Boca Raton, Fla.-based investment newsletter Gold & Energy Advisor, recalled that the collapse of Asian American Corp. was relatively big news in the rare coin industry in the early 1990s.

DiGeorgia wrote an article in September 1993 that criticized the high markups that Bellefontaine charged his customers for gold coin investments. At the time, Asian American was charging its customers $925 for half-ounce gold coins called American Eagles when the wholesale price for those coins was about $460, DiGeorgia said.

DiGeorgia said he is surprised that Bellefontaine has resurfaced and is keeping a relatively high profile in Bali after skipping out on so many of his local customers.

"Anybody doing business with this guy should know he has never stepped up to the plate. He left people hanging and never paid restitution," DiGeorgia said. "He defrauded people of millions of dollars. This was a terrible event in the numismatics industry."

Those lost millions will probably never be recovered.

Before Bellefontaine left the Islands, the state Office of Consumer Protection had filed a civil lawsuit against him in June 1995, alleging that he misled scores of customers. In August 1996, state Circuit Judge Allene Suemori ordered Bellefontaine and his firm to pay $4 million in fines to the state for misleading investors.

The Office of Consumer Protection, led by staff attorney Jeffrey Brunton, recovered about $100,000 by suing a Mainland trust company that held some of the investors' coins. But most of the $4 million judgment went uncollected because the Office of Consumer Protection later discovered that Bellefontaine did not own any real property in the U.S. that they could seize.

The FBI also began a theft investigation into Bellefontaine in 1995 but never pressed charges. The feds eventually closed the case and are unlikely to open a new case because the five-year statute of limitations for theft has already run out.

Assistant U.S. Attorney Les Osborne, who was assigned to the case, declined comment because no criminal charges were filed.

"It's really outrageous that someone can get away with something like this," said Stephen Levins, director of the Office of Consumer Protection.

"It's truly unfortunate," Levins said, "that if in fact he engaged in criminal conduct that he was able to skirt the criminal process by fleeing for parts unknown."

Reach Rick Daysog at rdaysog@honoluluadvertiser.com.
_________________________
KuKuKaChu: dangerously too sophisticated

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#85397 - 03 Sep 08 06:38 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: KuKuKaChu]
KuKuKaChu Moderator Offline
Pooh Bah

Registered: 09 Oct 05
Posts: 10790
Loc: Centre of the Universe
From http://www.balibs.org/news-update/Affordable-Lifestyles-International-Villas.shtml

Bali’s expatriate crooks and fraudsters; be warned buyers of villas
By Made Mephitis-Mephitis
Apr 30, 2007, 07:12


Bali Villas Bellefontaine, fraudster then and now.
Lawrence Bellefontaine presents himself as a highly respected expatriate in Bali, president of the local tennis club and who operates one of the tropical island’s largest Bali villas real estate businesses, PT Bali Affordable Lifestyles International (AKA PT Bali or rather PT B.A.L.I.). The facts are though that his real name is Barry Bellefontaine who sailed from his native Honolulu with his wife in their expensive 50-foot-yacht in July 1995 to Bali. Not un-coincidentally it seems, in June 1995 the state Office of Consumer Protection in Honolulu filed a lawsuit against him for “misleading” his customers. But Barry AKA Lawrence Bellefontaine decided to set sail with all his ill-gotten gains for Bali, Indonesia.

Just as well perhaps, as in August 1996, the state ordered Bellefontaine and his firm to pay $4 million in fines for misleading investors of his US investment company, Asian American Corp. which specialized in taking people’s money to buy rare coins, or it seems not! Previous customers of Mr. Bellefontaine claim he skipped town, did a bunk with their money and coins, which it seems was premeditated. You see, the US Office of Consumer Protection only recovered about $100,000 in coins but could not get back anywhere near the $4 million because Barry / Lawrence Bellefontaine did not have any real assets in the USA; but Mr. Bellefontaine clearly had tons of his investor’s cash on hand to finance his yacht and new luxurious lifestyle in Bali! Many of his cheated customers in the USA say they sank their life savings into what they thought was a safe and better investment than anything else on offer and with someone they could trust! Unfortunately they could not trust Bellefontaine who sailed off into the sunset not telling anyone where he was going.

Perhaps Barry or is it Lawrence has changed his ways though; we think not! Even if you get past the fact Mr. Bellefontaine clearly is still avoiding certain ex-customers and justice in the USA, he describes his company as “Honest, Reliable, Experienced, Professional Real Estate Agents with over 30 years international experience”. Yet like other nasty expatriates on Bali selling holiday homes to foreigners from his web site, ptbalirealestate dot con, claims to offer remarkable, even millionaire making invest opportunities on Freehold properties. Thing is, foreigners can not own land in Bali, only Indonesian citizens can, which can only mean Lawrence Bellefontaine is still the same old liar and cheat. Further proof of this is Bellefontaine even claims his company is 100% Indonesian owned, but how can it be when you look at their web site’s registration data, which clearly contains several falsehoods? Ptbalirealestate dot con, a clear misuse of the Indonesian registered company designation “PT” is actually registered to: Lawrence Bellefontaine lawrence@baliagents.com, Jl. Karangsari #2, Sanur, Bali with the false zip code and phone number 00000 ID / +1.9999999999. Even “better” and perhaps laughable is the admin contact for “their” other domain baliluxuryvillasales dot con, which lists the admin contact as “Captain Lawrence”; we know that the foreign expatriates in Bali are the most pretentious expats in the world, but this pirate from Hawaii really takes the salted biscuit!

However, although we would not normally jump to the defense of someone we consider to be human garbage as we do Mr. Bellefontaine, we would point out that his falsehood purveying real estate business is just as bad as it seems every other foreign owned real estate business is in Bali. We also believe many if not most of the other foreign expat owners of businesses in Bali are likely just as crooked as Bellefontaine; we have said all along Bali’s expatriate community [sic] is full of crooks evading real justice in a land where only bought “justice” exists.

It never ceases to amaze us how so many nasty expatriates in Bali go about presenting themselves as legitimate, professional, ethical businessmen while all the time they are thieves, shop keepers, sex abusers including pedophiles (yes they are, UNICEF says Bali is a foreign pedophile black spot) and “spiritual enlightenment” seekers (pot smoking la-la's). Every Bali villas real estate web site in English (what else) we have seen all have advertisements stating “Freehold land for sale” and “Luxury Villa Freehold For Sale”. Even companies claiming to be Australian owned are guilty of misleading gullible foreign “investors” enchanted by friendly Balinese smiles and the hypnotic palm trees and gamelan music, looking for their slice of paradise and perhaps a rental income in Bali. Listen up, it is all a pack of lies, do not be so naïve, do not get stung by these pompous foreign crooks.

Once someone makes an enquiry with these Balinese villas sales companies, likely after they have fallen in love with a property and believe the false concept everything in Bali is smiles and wonderful, elements of the truth start to creep out from these expatriate sales creeps in Bahama shorts. First comes the news that an Indonesian “name giver” has to own the land the villa sits on, as “technically” foreigners can not own land in Bali; “technically” indeed! Foreigners can not own land as individuals; that is the law and quite some technicality we would say! So the term “name giver” is also a subterfuge, lies, a way of making foreigners with more money than sense believe they can own something they never can; “name givers” therefore are the Indonesian people foreigners are conned into buying land for!

Now of course most foreigners interested in buying a property in Bali would not fall for that one alone and in isolation; the later being the issue, as every villa sales agent is at it and there is nowhere in Bali it seems of course to get impartial professional advice. So these pillars of expatriate society in Bali then go on to tell their victims about how they secure their rights to the villa and land by way of a nominee agreement, signed by the “name giver”, giving exclusive unencumbered rights to the land for 25 years with an automatic 25 year renewal, plus automatic title to the land if Indonesia ever changes its land ownership laws to allow foreign owners. Some sales agents tell punters that these agreements have been proven in Bali’s law courts; BS, BS, BS!

First of all just look at the sheer blatant idiocy of what Bali’s villa salesmen are saying! If an agreement can legally automatically renew after 25 years for another 25 years, why can’t they have a 50 year agreement from the start? This con is based on the “Hak Pakai” right to use permit which allows a foreigner who is resident in and contributing to the economy of Indonesia the right to have exclusive use of property for 25 years, which then can be extended for another 25 years if both the property owner and they mutually agree. But Bali’s nasty villa sales brigade are not selling “right of use”, they are selling false “freeholds”. Even if they were selling Hak Pakai agreements, foreigners would have to come live, work and pay taxes in Indonesia; we will come to that nasty aspect later. Bali’s villa agents will repudiate this by saying the latest Hak Pakai legislation (No. 7 of 1996 or RMA 7/96) was accompanied with a letter by the then Minister for Agraria stating this law should also apply to foreigners who were only in Indonesia from time-to-time; the problem is, it was only a letter, it was not and is not part of the law.

So these jumped up liars selling bits of meaningless paper have to come up with yet more subterfuges to con foreigners they are buying something they can not own; enter the nominee agreement which they claim to have been already upheld in Bali’s courts, pah! If the law does not allow you to own something, how can unlawful nominee agreements have been upheld in court? First of all this Hak Pakai RMA 7/96 letter from the then Minister for Agraria is worth as much in an Indonesian court as an empty Snickers bar wrapper; Indonesian courts regularly ignore the current President’s recent decrees, let alone some letter written by an ex-junior minister years ago. OK, maybe some bent (aren’t they all) judge in Bali took some dollars from some foreigner and made a highly dubious ruling, once, but would that ruling stand up in Indonesia’s Supreme Court in Jakarta? We don’t think so! The fact these foreign sales cronies write into their worthless unlawful bits of paper such things as “automatic renewals” and “automatic title transfer to the foreigner if ever Indonesian law allows it” makes the documents even more unlawful; because no country, especially Indonesia allows what is called retrospective law. Remember how many of the Bali bombers and their stooge Bashir got off lightly because they were tried under criminal codes that were enacted after the bombing and therefore could not be applied to the terrorists for that pre-legislation attack?

But the con by these un-convicted crooks does not end there, oh no! Part of the lure for gullible foreigners to pay thousands if not millions of dollars for worthless bits of paper is the “investment” prospect, which is just as much a falsehood of course as the villa ownership crock. People like confirmed on the run fraudster Bellefontaine make foreigners believe they can earn massive rental revenues and that their “investment” (worthless bit of paper) will grow dramatically. The problem with this apart from the obvious pre-illustrated fact that foreign investors will have nothing to sell some other poor schlep but a worthless bit of paper, is that foreigners can not legally rent their properties out to anyone, not even foreign tourists! Many think they can of course and do, therefore breaking Indonesian law by offering their personal holiday homes as commercial vacation villa rentals. Unlawful? Absolutely, unless a villa or any other type of commercial (fee accepting) accommodation has an Indonesian operational license, it is operating illegally, period.

OK, so all the foreign “owner” of a villa needs to do is get an Indonesian operational permit right? Sorry, just as it is not possible for a foreigner to own land in Bali, it is equally not possible or perhaps viable for them to get an operational license. The only way a foreigner can get an operational license for “their” villa is to form an expensive public company (not possible for single villa operations) or a foreign investment company called a Penanaman Modal Asing (PMA). But the problems there are any foreigner wanting to start a PMA must submit the company’s trading plan prior to acquiring whatever it is they will be doing (no good if you have already “bought” a villa) and that PMA’s are not allowed to own land; the later fact should warn foreigners what the courts will think about a nominee / name giver agreement! The only other option for a foreigner is to have Indonesians form a private company (PT) for “you” in which you can neither be a shareholder or a director, which can then (hopefully) get an operational license to offer rentals, and pay taxes, and administration fees, and filing fees. But then what does the foreigner own? Why they own an even more worthless piece of paper as not only is the land in an Indonesian’s name but now everything on it is in Indonesians’ names; some freehold!

Also be warned, the wealthy military connected Javanese owners of hotels across the island are not happy with all these illegal and even legal “foreign owned” villas because they are sucking their business away during a very bad time for Bali tourism wise. It is likely there will soon be no new permits available for villas in the south of Bali! Plus there are already reports of illegal villas being closed down by the authorities; Some investment Mr. Bellefontaine!

We say if you have been tricked into buying a worthless bit of paper already in Bali; a) Let us know about it and b) If there are not some Balinese you can trust totally with your investment to form a PT and get your villa legal, consider an exclusive agreement with as reputable as you can find registered villa management company who can perhaps apply for an operational license on your behalf. No, you won’t likely get a great amount of the money they charge guests staying at your home in Bali, but at least you are a lot less likely of having that home taken away from you. Although we do not recommend him per say, the most established company on the island we believe is that operated by Pieter Rieger of balivillas dot com. But even this option has a sting in the tale of course. As the foreign owner of something in Bali, you have to register with the tax authority; yes you do. The problem then comes that Indonesia claims tax on people's worldwide incomes. Oh sure, there are tax balancing agreements with other countries where you can offset your tax liability in one by proving you paid tax into another. But Indonesia has incredibly very high income tax levels, and foreigners may well be asked to pay a percentage of the money they earn working in their home country!

Therefore, our earnest advice is ff you have not yet bought your worthless bit of paper masquerading as Balinese villas, don’t; don’t buy into this fraudulently sold dream and don’t line the pockets of the nasty expatriate villa sales crooks in Bali.
_________________________
KuKuKaChu: dangerously too sophisticated

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#85398 - 03 Sep 08 06:44 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: KuKuKaChu]
KuKuKaChu Moderator Offline
Pooh Bah

Registered: 09 Oct 05
Posts: 10790
Loc: Centre of the Universe
From http://www.3c-ltd.com/v2/2006_sgsite/speaker_bio.html

Mr. Lawrence Bellefontaine
President, PT Bali, Affordable Lifestyles
Earning Handsome Profits in Bali While Enjoying a Home in Paradise

* How foreigners can legally purchase properties in the exciting Bali real estate market.
* How to obtain a visa that will allow foreigners long-term stays in Bali.
* Which areas of Bali offer the best investment potential and what type of properties are the most successful.
* How to enjoy a second home in Bali an earn 15% to 30% per year.

Mr. Bellafontaine is the President of one of Bali’s largest realtors & developers. Editor of weekly “Real Estate” newspaper column. Clients include the head of General Electric & Ritz Carlton S/E Asia & business people from around the globe.
_________________________
KuKuKaChu: dangerously too sophisticated

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#85399 - 03 Sep 08 06:55 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: KuKuKaChu]
KuKuKaChu Moderator Offline
Pooh Bah

Registered: 09 Oct 05
Posts: 10790
Loc: Centre of the Universe
Now this is interesting. this article published in The Jakarta Post written by a woman simply called "Dewi", which coincidently just happens to be the name of "Lawrence's" Balinese hatchet girl.

Bali sees increase in demand for property

The Jakarta Post , Jakarta | Fri, 03/23/2007 4:26 PM

Dewi, Contributor, Bali

Past visitors to Bali are familiar with the sight and sound of hawkers on the streets who eagerly approach tourists and ask:mister, want to buy sunglasses or fake watches?"" Now many hawkers are sayingmister, want to buy some land?""

This change in sales pitch has resulted from the dramatic increase in foreign demand for property in Bali in the last five years.

Tourists are once again arriving in droves in Bali as indicated by the high arrival figures last month.

Inevitably, a small portion of the six million annual tourists to Indonesia will in the last days of their vacation investigate purchasing a vacation home or investment villa.

Veteran Bali realtor, developer and newspaper columnist Lawrence Bellefontaine, a resident of Bali for the last 10 years, is optimistic about future demand and prices for Bali property.

He cites the fact that five years ago only a handful of foreigners took the risk of buying property in Bali due to the economic crisis in the aftermath of president Soeharto's downfall.

A three-bedroom luxury villa in those days could be had for as little as US$149,000, but now would sell for twice that.

Although prices leveled off for approximately a year following the 2002 and 2005 bombings, they have never fallen and are now beginning to increase rapidly once again.

Bellefontaine says,best future indictor for Bali real estate is the daily hits received on the Bali real estate website www.ptbalirealestate.com.

In January this year, over 37,000 interested buyers and renters from around the world checked out this website. This is a whopping 38 percent increase over January of last year.

Most of the potential clients want a piece of Bali, which has for the past five consecutive years been named the best island in the world by Travel & Leisure magazine.

Any unprejudiced observer would agree with the Balinese phrase ""Bali Bagus"" (Bali is Good).

Many readers may be ready to act on that and buy a second home or retire here.

Bellefontaine warns, however, that due to the fact that there are no licensing requirements for Bali realtors and agents, purchasing property in Bali can be a dangerous minefield of misinformation and misrepresentation.

He recommends potential buyers adopt his philosophy ofnothing and trust no one"" unless they have excellent verifiable references from sophisticated clients.


Directors of major companies such as The Ritz Carlton and General Electric have relied on Bellefontaine's advice in the past and have purchased vacation investment villas in Bali.

There is no long-term risk in buying Bali real estate.
_________________________
KuKuKaChu: dangerously too sophisticated

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#85400 - 03 Sep 08 07:04 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: KuKuKaChu]
KuKuKaChu Moderator Offline
Pooh Bah

Registered: 09 Oct 05
Posts: 10790
Loc: Centre of the Universe
From http://www.mail-archive.com/sos@bali-in-danger.net/msg00022.html


----- Original Message ----
From: Asana Viebeke Lengkong <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: sos@bali-in-danger.net; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Sunday, 15 October, 2006 10:25:29 PM
Subject: [sos-bali] BALI......

A Hindu place for ugly people?

Monaco was once called a "Sunny place for shady people." Is Bali fast becoming a "Hindu place for ugly people?"

Recent trends in advertising on the island of the gods have left local observers gob-smacked!

Lawrence Bellefontaine of PT Bali Real Estate, for example, wrote, in a paper titled Bali Benefits from Thailand's Woes for a Smart Property Conference, held in Singapore in late September 2006, that "the bombings and the coup in Thailand will benefit Bali Tourism."

"What goes around comes around," he added.

It seems a very ugly way to sell villas!

Not since the October 2002 Kuta bomb -- when a six star hotel strung a banner across the highway which read "We at the (six star hotel) are concerned about the bomb" -- have we seen such ugly opportunism.


_________________________
KuKuKaChu: dangerously too sophisticated

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#85401 - 03 Sep 08 07:16 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: KuKuKaChu]
Phoenix Offline
Member

Registered: 22 Aug 08
Posts: 12
Loc: .
jesus kuku --- did he stitch up one of your clients?

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#85402 - 03 Sep 08 07:30 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Phoenix]
KuKuKaChu Moderator Offline
Pooh Bah

Registered: 09 Oct 05
Posts: 10790
Loc: Centre of the Universe
Quoting: Phoenix
jesus kuku --- did he stitch up one of your clients?

very nearly. and i've had a few requests for assistance over the years from people caught up with this fellow.

nasty piece of work.
_________________________
KuKuKaChu: dangerously too sophisticated

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#85407 - 03 Sep 08 10:01 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: KuKuKaChu]
witty handle Offline
Member*

Registered: 11 Mar 08
Posts: 933
Loc: Bogor
the name alone should put one off straight away...lawrence bellefontaine indeed.
_________________________
quips,gibes and irony all form part of my repartee

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#85411 - 03 Sep 08 11:57 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: witty handle]
Roy's Hair Offline
Pujangga Besar

Registered: 08 Nov 06
Posts: 3974
Loc: jakarta
Bastard
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#85419 - 03 Sep 08 12:13 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Roy's Hair]
L. Bellefontaine Offline
Member

Registered: 03 Sep 08
Posts: 17
Loc: Bali
Go Fuck yourself Kukukachu. You've been spreading slander about me for far too long and all because of one night in that Saigon titty bar. I'll see you in court buddy boy.

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#85422 - 03 Sep 08 12:16 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: L. Bellefontaine]
KuKuKaChu Moderator Offline
Pooh Bah

Registered: 09 Oct 05
Posts: 10790
Loc: Centre of the Universe
what can i say? i'm trembling at the knees, lawrence ... the mere thought of being butt fucked by you again just turns me to jelly ...
_________________________
KuKuKaChu: dangerously too sophisticated

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#85423 - 03 Sep 08 12:22 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: KuKuKaChu]
witty handle Offline
Member*

Registered: 11 Mar 08
Posts: 933
Loc: Bogor
Quoting: KuKuKaChu
what can i say? i'm trembling at the knees, lawrence ... the mere thought of being butt fucked by you again just turns me to jelly ...


wow!! kkkc, i never knew you were also a special one
_________________________
quips,gibes and irony all form part of my repartee

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#85424 - 03 Sep 08 12:23 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: KuKuKaChu]
Roy's Hair Offline
Pujangga Besar

Registered: 08 Nov 06
Posts: 3974
Loc: jakarta
You are not the real Harry Barry Belafonte and I claim my five pounds.
_________________________
Chinese like more traditional patterns on their ring.

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#85482 - 03 Sep 08 20:57 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Roy's Hair]
KuKuKaChu Moderator Offline
Pooh Bah

Registered: 09 Oct 05
Posts: 10790
Loc: Centre of the Universe
Lawrence's keywords:

Barry Bellefontaine Lawrence Bellefonte Captain Lawrence Canadian con-man Bali PT Bali Affordable Lifestyles International

Bali real estate,Bali,Indonesia,bungalow,villa,house,land,building, house for rent, land for sale, property, properties,Bali Real Estate - Property Listings International Real Estate garden villa, budget rent, land lease, visa,bali, bali accommodation, bali accomodation, bali holiday, bali holidays, bali honeymoon, bali hotel villas, bali hotels, bali houses, bali luxury villa, bali luxury villas, bali private villa, bali private villa rental, bali private villa rentals, bali private villas, bali property, bali property rental, bali real estate, bali rentals, bali resorts, bali tropical villas, bali vacation, bali vacation rental, bali vacation rentals, bali villa, bali villa accommodation, bali villa rental, bali villa rentals, bali villas, bali villas for sale, bali weddings, indo villas, indovillas, jimbaran, kuta, seminyak, legian, sienna villas bali, villa bali, villa in bali, notary, lawyer, lovina, north bali, real estate,realestate

"Locate your perfect Bali real estate quickly on 12 Bali real estate web sites totaling over 5,000 pages of Bali real estate Bali homes, Bali villas, Bali land, Bali properties, Bali factories, stores, offices for sale, lease, rent or let. Free Bali real estate newsletter."
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KuKuKaChu: dangerously too sophisticated

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#85489 - 03 Sep 08 21:54 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: KuKuKaChu]
Marmalade Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 18 Apr 08
Posts: 2471
Loc: Jak
I notice 'ballbag' or 'shithead' aren't included. An oversight, perhaps...
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JakartaRestaurantReviews.com


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#85501 - 04 Sep 08 07:37 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Marmalade]
KuKuKaChu Moderator Offline
Pooh Bah

Registered: 09 Oct 05
Posts: 10790
Loc: Centre of the Universe
Here's the story of "Captain" "Lawrence's" experience as a yachtie .... and his rescue by the Australian Navy.

From http://www.humanpower.freeserve.co.uk/note031200a.htm

The Crossing from Bima - Sumbawa Indonesia to
Darwin Northern Territories - Australia


Richards account of the crossing from Indonesia to Australia


Andrew and I were both in a state of exhaustion after our 4 day paddling odyssey through Komodo National Park. As we dozed off into a comatose state, a sharp wrap came at our hotel door inside Hotel L'ambitu Bima. At the door were the grinning faces of Dean and Captain Lawrence. 'Hey.....you guys.....how come you're sleeping?' with an air of confidence Lawrence continued 'You must be Tim-right?', this was Lawrence's first mistake. There would be others. The sea had been flat calm from Bali through to the Eastern end of Sumbawa, and 'La Boheme' had made good time. We hadn't expected to see them until tomorrow, and so we were a little dazed by the sudden appearance of a smiling Dean and the jovial Canadian Captain of our charter yacht for Australia. Whilst Lawrence went in search of a 'Massousse' and a few beers, Dean excitedly chattered about the brushes with whales, porpoises, turtles and the comfortable, even enjoyable cruise that they had enjoyed from Bali.

'Jump on, jump on Dan for God's sake', the yacht scraped excruciatingly along the concrete jetty at Bima port. With a sharp crack, one of the rear starboard-side halyards snapped and flailed, and the rubber tender grazed the side before we lurched erratically out into the deeper water. Our captain couldn't understand why one of his crew hadn't jumped on in the confusion and rapid acceleration. Of course we knew why he hadn't got on; but somehow we didn't feel it appropriate to contradict our enthusiastic captain.

A gentle breeze whistled in from the North as we made our way around the final cape of Sumbawa. Spirits running high the team and crew were all smiles. We were being treated like customers on a luxury cruise. Incidentally, we had paid as if we were customers on a luxury cruise. Our crew of 5 scurried around looking after our every requirement. Dan, from Yeovil Somerset, and Pablo, the Scotsman with a shock of dyed blonde hair, would be our crew from here to Darwin. Avie was our cook. Petrified of what was about to unfold; we tried to reassure her that everything would be just fine. The two Indonesian crew Ketuk and Madee would come only as far as Kupang in West Timor, from where they would fly back to Bali.

Our captain, Lawrence, from British Columbia Canada, had sailed to Indonesia some 4 years previously aboard La Boheme. He was clearly keen to look after us, and was chirpy and friendly towards us. His habit of asking a question and then only listening to half the answer was a little annoying, but we let that ride. We didn't feel quite as lenient however, to his abrupt orders that were barked from the wheel. The conspicuous absence of p's and q's, somehow didn't feel right for the captain of a yacht where everyone lives in close confinement.

On the first night, sunset approached, and we were crossing the Komodo Straits, bound for the southern Cape. Pablo duly scurried off to fix us ice cold Bintangs as we waved goodbye to Sumbawa. Calm waters, great weather, amongst friends, and bound for Australia, life looked rosy. Tim organised a Human Powered celebratory game to commemorate the true culmination of 'Human Power'. Now we would attempt to sail to Darwin. This vain desire, however, lasted for just a few hours. We set the sails in the hope of catching sufficient wind to propel us on our way. Our speed barely flickered above one knot, and so the writing seemed to be on the wall. Andrew and I held a brief discussion beneath the stars on the foredeck.

After having spent such a huge amount of money on the crossing, in order that we might maintain our non-fossil fuel journey, it seems that we shall now be motoring, after just one day afloat. With more than a tinge of regret we concede that we shall have to motor; particularly bearing in mind all the recent weather forecasts for the Timor Sea that have been showing widely spaced Isobars and only the faintest wisps of wind.

Fair weather prevails all the way until Timor. Scorching sunshine beats down on the deck and the team seek out whatever shade is to be found. A couple of times we pause for open sea swimming where we all take it in turns to practise our diving; flying either from the bowsprit or directly from the side. We're visited by a couple of schools of dolphins en route and despite not being able to sail, we're quite happy. We eat well. Dan and Pablo have by now picked up the task of preparing our meals as well. Avie has been sleeping or staring in fear at the watery horizon, ever since our departure from Bima. Its quite clear that she shouldn't be out here; she's scared out of her wits and sick even from the gentle swaying motion of the boat.

The rude issuing of orders from the wheel has, by the time we approach Kupang reached serious proportions. Madee is shouting back at Lawrence; clearly not prepared to put up with the barrage of orders and lack of thanks. Dan and Pablo, are both also losing their motivation for the trip. We're concerned that they may look to jump ship in Kupang too. At that point of course we would find ourselves in a very difficult spot; four hundred and seventy miles from Darwin without a crew. Around this time it becomes clear that despite being paying customers we must look after Dan and Pablo. Without them we shan’t be going to Australia.

We slowly draw closer to Kupang. The wide circular horizon extending on all sides further than the eye can make out curves away into nothing. This bare landscape without landmarks, gives way to the approach to Kupang, and at around 5pm on the 28th November we're dropping anchor just off shore and readying ourselves for a calm night in sight of dry land.

Whilst Andrew, Tim, Rich, Lawrence, Dan and Pablo make for the bright lights of Kupang's restaurants, Dean and I opt for a quiet night being cooked for by Avie. Strips of deep fried chicken and fried potatoes with lashings of ketchup make for a tasty meal, and we're turning in early hoping to get a good night's sleep. The next morning it turns out that none of the team have returned to the boat. Trying to contain our anxiety we put it down to maybe a few beers and then a contingency plan of staying in one of the town's small hotels. On arrival back it turns out that the real story is a little less benign. On their return to La Boheme, the guys walked past some police who asked to see their passports. On not being able to produce them, a trigger happy officer decided to fire off a couple of rounds from his pistol. The guys are a little shaken but otherwise quite fine. Tim takes some time to contemplate last night's events, and sits quietly for a couple of hours with furrowed brow. After breakfast, we head back into the town to provision, and to send a quick note home. Rich S gets the hardest of the jobs, and is packed off with Lawrence to get us stamped out from Indonesia. This is the reason, that in spite of our intentions never to get close to Timor, we find ourselves overnighting here.

Kupang seems to be functioning perfectly normally. The town is bustling and busy, and the locals seem to be in pretty good spirits. We chat to an Indonesian employee of the UN, and try to get a snapshot of the current climate here. Elya tells us that the big issue here in Indonesian Timor is the continual flow of refugees from recently independent East Timor. Apart from this, she says everything is quite normal. Its difficult to put one's finger on it, but there is a kind of hollow feeling to the place. The normal Indonesian shouting and laughing is somewhat subdued. We don't hang around here for too long. We get food and drinks and then we're back aboard the boat ready to leave.

'Rough water ahead', at the bow position I shout out to Lawrence. Ominous white caps are breaking not far away, and it looks as if a reef is below the surface causing the disturbance in the water. Images of our 51ft ketch run aground on a reef race through my mind. In a panic Laurence spins the wheel violently. The yacht lurches suddenly as we enter the rough water. 'We're on a reef', colour drains in an instant from his face, and we all look at each other. Seconds later the depth sounder is reporting two hundred feet of water. In the confusion the swell is hitting us from all sides. Dean shouts that she definitely doesn't want to be here. With an almighty gush, a heavy rolling wave swamps the aft deck. Soaking all of us, and catching us all unawares, our hearts are in our mouths. The boat tips and rolls nauseatingly. Our grips tighten on the railings around our seats. We hope they'll hold fast. We all slide one way and the next in time, but a little too stteply to be laughing. As the water flattens and we leave the violent chop behind, Laurence begins laughing. 'You know that's quite normal', he puffs proudly. 'Three sets of current are coming together just at the tip of that headland, and boom!' he gestures with his hands rising up to the sky. It is intended that we should believe that Laurence was quite ready for the rough water. Somehow I can't help but wonder why he took us straight through the middle of it, and why he thought it was a reef. Our confidence in our captain has taken a knock.

Evening approaches, and after a brief respite the sea roughens once more. The wind picks up a notch and we motor on into a choppy stormy night. We make do with a makeshift meal from the galley. Avie is now firmly planted in a horizontal position; eyes tightly shut and praying for deliverance. Dan and Pablo stagger around and make us some fried chicken and baked potatoes. In the darkness the yacht continues to wander back and forth. With no horizon to fix my eyes upon my head swims. Our motion is something like a roller coaster ride with the lights off. Just the phosphorescent wash off the bow as we crash into successive waves shows that we are rolling back and forth, up and down, in and out of the sea. I stuff down my food as quickly as I can and head down below. It seems that in the horizontal position with eyes closed I can avoid sea sickness quite effectively. Nadine, my fiancee grips my hand tightly, and whispers 'Get me out of here Rich'. The swell washes up and over the portholes. Adrift from the Australian mainland by still a full three and a half days at best, I know that we're going to have to be brave. I also suspect that I'll be lying if I say that its going to get better. We enter stormier conditions overnight, and Dan, Pablo and Lawrence take their watches through the darkness. We can feel the bow rearing up and then crashing down. I try to imagine what kind of animal would move as we are, with this strange lolloping gait. My confused mind reasons that we're galloping like some kind of lame horse. Shortly afterwards I slip into a fitful slumber. From our first night it takes us a further eighty four hours to reach the shallowing waters of the Northern Territories Australia. Time becomes rather confused, and nights and days become one. We take turns to take the helm, and we edge towards Australia.Overnight thunder, lightning and rain lash the decks and the winds whip up sickening swells. From our tiny circular portholes we watch brightly silhouetted lavender tinted clouds splashed with brilliant light by fantastic electrical storms. We also watch spellbound, on a clear night as we cross beneath the patchwork of Southern Hemisphere constellations. The mast cuts the sky like a blade and we hold course by selecting a notable star on our bearing and heading for hour after darkness hour in that direction.

On day three we awake to discover that overnight the wind and waves have been fighting us hard for the last ten hours. Our progress has dwindled from our usual 5 to 6 nautical miles per hour down to a grinding three. On the GPS we watch with growing concern as our estimated time of arrival climbs again to almost 2 more days. It seems to have been hovering at 2 days for the last 2 days. Our thoughts stretch out to Australia as we creep forwards. At first I had been prepared to write off the minor weather disturbances as rain showers. My barometer shows steady high pressure - so no cause for alarm. Now, however, with the wind freshening, the 3 to 4 metre swell looking pretty set, and our forward speed not much better than a slow moving tortoise, I am truly becoming concerned. Its around now that we all begin to realise the power and danger of the sea. The feeling of being so far from help and from safety. The feeling that the weather has easily within its potential to overwhelm our tiny craft, and crush us in its awesome power. We all would like some good news and some help. Contrarily, Laurence announces that we don't actually have enough fuel to reach Darwin. So to add to our concerns of the weather, we also now juggle with the thought that when we do come within range of the coast, we may find ourselves without enough fuel to negociate any reefs or waterborne hazards that we may encounter. There seems to be only one sensible course of action with a shortage of diesel.

Two of our sails however are torn. We have a broken shackle on the jib. Our captain seems very reticent to hoist the sails. Indeed, even in calmer seas, when any true sailor would have felt ashamed to have been motoring, when any true sailor would have leapt at the chance of the peace and tranquillity of drifting under sail; even at a reduced speed, our captain would not be drawn into hoisting his main. Our captain it had become clear, was not a sailing man. When finally we did manage to get agreement on proceeding under sail power, we were unable to make good progress upwind. With the wind whistling in directly from Darwin we could at best make a course of approximately 140 degrees. During this time our captain spent his time making more accurate time calculating exactly how much fuel we had in our tanks.

We continued motoring just a few hours later. Making now for the nearest point of the Northern Territories. Although the weather had been fine and pleasant in the middle of the day, the wind, clouds and rain were not far away. The afternoon wore on and the conditions deteriorated. The boat shuddered and shook on each mighty crashing wave that we broached. The tinkle of glasses, and the horrible mess of food spilling out of the refrigerator, and the dripping of water through the hatches and down into the cabins, all combine to make a nasty mess down below. By now we have damp beds, damp clothes, sticky patches of congealed food behind the fire extinguisher in the corner, and difficulty in staying on the toilet as the boat rolls uncontrollably. The GPS continues to say that we are 2 days away from land - even late on in the afternoon. Just as we are all beginning to wonder what unexpected and nasty turn the adventure is going to take next, a crackle of interference and a loud broad accented Australian voice echos around the galley. Coastwatch, the Australian Airforce patrol who sweeps the enormous Northern coast, has a visual contact with us and has contacted us on channel sixteen the international emergency and distress channel. Laurence clambers downstairs to respond. The heavily falling rain and water from his waterproofs drenches the floor as he staggers across to the radio, bracing himself against the wildly rocking boat.

'La Boheme - La Boheme, this is Australian Coastwatch, do you copy?' is followed by a few magical words 'La Boheme - La Boheme - .....we have a Navy Patrol Boat in your vicinity and we shall be asking the H.M.A.S. Lawn-sess-ton to come within radio contact of yourselves in order to look at offering assistance'. Our situation had not changed dramatically during those few moments. The boat continued to crash against the relentless waves, and the messy carnage down below continued unabated. And yet from being alone in this frightening situation, we now had a friend, a crew of competent seamen to assist us if we hit serious difficulties. An hour passes in minutes and through the mist and rain we make out the dark green and grey of Launceston powering through the waves.

' La Boheme - La Boheme - this is HMAS Laun-sess-ton - are you receiving - over?'. Launceston directs us towards the nearest landfall, and advises us that there is nothing immediately that they can do for us. Of course at the moment we have no immediate danger. But we all, that is except for our captain, are aware that things are deteriorating, and that without too much imagination we shall find ourselves in an altogether more serious situation. Night encloses us once more, and Launceston departs, satisfied that today there is nothing more that she can do for us. Dean and Avi are both taking shelter below as the four in our team, Laurence and his two crew huddle together on deck. It is quite clear now that we are rapidly approaching an emergency situation. We are all as the saying goes 'In The Same Boat' and therefore we agree that each one of us will do what we can to get us through the situation. Now we must all pull for each other. The dividing line of customers and crew must be scrubbed if we are to get through this spot. Andrew and Tim within a few minutes of each other bring their dinners back up, vomiting overboard into the wind. In our cabin, Dean is sobbing into her pillow, nervously chattering about wanting to be at home. In a fit of rage she flies at me and vents her anger and helplessness, thumping me as hard as her fists will allow 'Get me out of here', she bawls. All our worst nightmares are rapidly coming true.

Another stormy night ensues. The conditions seem to be getting worse as time unfolds. In the darkness we feel the bow rising high in the air over each successive wave. We then sail through the air as the wave passes beneath us, and then we rejoin the sea with a crash as we hit the next wave. The shudder that jolts the hull at each crash is enough to make one fear for our immediate safety. Overnight we hear boxes and water bottles work themselves loose and roll and rattle their way around the cabin. We try to ignore, and continue saying our prayers.

Day breaks, and I go above decks and offer my assistance to Lawrence. 'You don't want to be up here', unfortunately for our captain there are no prizes for stating the obvious. Over the last few days Lawrence has had not much more than a few hours sleep, and I wonder whether his judgement is sound. Its just a few minutes later and the boat is taking blows from every angle. Each one feels strong enough to be the boat's last. We teeter at precarious angles and the crew and our team hang on for dear life. After a particularly loud crack I hear Laurence shouting for help. Clambering up on to the deck I find that all hell has broken loose. The wind has strengthened, and breaking waves surround us. The deck is awash from breaking waves, the sun awning is mainly blown off, and Laurence is clinging grimly to his deck mounted compass. As a wave washed across, the compass was broken from its mountings and before it fell overboard Laurence grabbed it. After stowing the compass we attempt to tie down the dangerously flailing metal poles of the awning. The sea has become wild, and the crests of the waves are being whipped off by the howling gale. Unbeknown to us at the time we are flirting with the outskirts of Cyclone Sam; Australia's first of the season.

Our speed has dropped further still, and although early in the day, amongst the maelstrom that is threatening to swallow us, we are just 25 nautical miles from shore. We sway and rock and at the helm, Dan does his level best to keep us at an angle to the worst of the waves. We all know that the storm is worsening and that Darwin is slipping away from us. Our fuel supplies dwindling, making painfully slow headway, and now without a compass I feel deeply uneasy at the situation. How are we going to reach a satisfactory situation. This view is compounded an hour and a half later when we inspect the GPS once more. Our distance to shore now.....twenty six point nine nautical miles. We're drifting away from Australia and from safety. Laurence is trying to navigate using only his GPS. At these slow speeds and veering erratically on the motion of the powerful waves the computer can't work out which direction we're heading in. I rack my brains for a compass. We must have one somewhere. Laurence certainly doesn't have a back up. We sent our handheld Silva one back home a few weeks earlier, having not used it. And then I remember the one that Nickers had given me back in Thailand - mounted on my handlebars, complete with bell.

'Pablo have you got a Phillips screwdriver', it doesn't really seem like the time to be fiddling around with bike maintenance, but its clear that we need a better indication of which direction to head in. Its far from perfect - but at least it gives us a chance.

'La Boheme - La Boheme - this is Coastal Watch - do you copy over?' a cry of delight goes up as the plane comes over 23 hours later than we had last heard them. A discussion ensues between Laurence and the radio operator over whether we are in distress, and whether we need immediate assistance. The plane will only be overhead for a short while, and we have a finite window where we can talk to them. After that we shall be back on our own. Whilst Laurence is on deck, out of earshot, we take the opportunity to explain that our situatio0n is indeed serious and we shall be requiring assistance as soon as it can reach us. Just before they go out of range, we hear Coastwatch calling Lauceston back once again to assist us.

'La Boheme - La Boheme this is Laun-sess-ton. We would like you to proceed on a bearing of one hundred and ten degrees. This will bring you into the sheltered anchorage of Dundee beach. There we expect the swell to settle out sufficiently to be able to launch our rib.' More cries of relief, and more tears. Dean is adamant by this point that she will be getting off La Boheme today. There won't be many more discussions on that subject. 'We intend to bring you more fuel and something warm to eat - over'. As we continue to fight our way through the still uncomfortable swells we are flanked by the reassuring bulk of Launceston. Every now and again we refresh radio contact with them, trying to give more information about our situation without wanting to overload the Captain with unnecessary details. The rain comes and goes and from time to time we lose visual contact with Launceston. A mist encircles us briefly but surely as we draw closer to land, the sea begins to settle. We attempt to muster some enthusiasm for our sighting of land and our first Australian vista, but in our drained condition its about all we can manage just to get up on deck and have a look. Some 4 miles off the shore line we finally get the nod from the Captain of HMAS Launceston. 'La Boheme La Boheme - this is HMAS Launsesston - ah yes....we shall not be able to proceed any further in to shore. If you can drop you forwards speed please. We shall be launching the rib and sending our guys over to you shortly, over'. The tiny rubber, partially stiffened inflatable dinghy zips across the tops of the waves as daylight begins to falter. Without any fuss or excitement, the four man crew manoeuvre alongside, and within moments they are aboard and charging the fuel tanks with diesel. Without discussion, the commands are shouted out clearly and unequivocally by X.O. Paul McCarthy, and his three crew immediately jump into action. Officer McCarthy explains that the navy has many other operational commitments to fulfill as well as assisting ailing pleasure craft. It is not normal procedure to take civilians aboard Patrol Boats unless the situation is a risk to life. He drops below whilst the fuel and food is being loaded aboard and talks with Dean who is going through every sort of emotion; unsure of whether she will be aboard for another night, being taken to the Launceston, or quite what is happening. After a brief radio discussion it is confirmed that Nadine and one other will go aboard Launceston and the remainder will head for shelter in shallower waters close to shore where the sea should be even more settled. After a few moments of discussion with Andrew, Tim and Rich, all of whom are also seriously shaken by the situation, it is agreed that I will leave with Dean. Dean, Freddo and Shuey pull the oldest trick in the book as we hop down into the rib. 'Aw, you've done the hardest bit ay! Getting up on to Launsesston - that's a piece of cake!'. We run before the waves in the grip of darkness, adrenaline pumping and a sheepish smile returning to Dean's face. In the half light we can just about see the moving horizon of the black waves rising to meet the ashen sky. Fully illuminated with navigation lights, Launceston is bathed in a deep red haze radiating from doors and windows. The decks are bustling with crew going about their business, whilst also trying to get a look at the 'Pommies' who have just been plucked from the yacht. Alongside we scramble up on to a rope ladder. The swell moves rythmically, the rib rising in steps up the sheer steel hull of Launceston. At the top of the third rise Shuey shouts 'Go - go' to Dean who steps up and is plucked from the rib by two strong arms who launch her up on to the main deck.

Unable to believe quite what has happened the two of us smile, a deep smile of relief. And then we think of the guys still on board La Boheme. 'Ow ya travellin now then choppa?' a friendly face gives us a wink, not expecting a reply. He doesn't get one. It takes me until I'm halfway down the corridor until I can figure out quite what he's said to me. Max the 'cheffo' cooks us up the most miraculous baked beans, tomato soup, chicken kebab combo that we have every tasted. His sarcastic drawl disguises what seems to be a concern for the two of us. He makes sure we're fed and watered and settled in for our night's sleep. Before we turn in though we get to meet the face behind the voice on the radio; the Captain of HMAS Launceston; Ken. We spend just a few moments thanking him and shaking his hand several times over. We hope he gets the message; we're truly grateful to the whole crew of Launceston. The two of us sleep soundly, despite the lumbering crashing reverberations as the Patrol Boat makes its way back up and around the North Coast.

In the morning we wake refreshed and find despite a fresh wind, and continuing whitecaps as far as the eye can see, the day has dawned sunny. Following breakfast of fresh fruit, milk tea and the legendary Ozzie vegemite on toast we make our way up to the flying bridge to watch our entry into Darwin Port. We watch the weather report come out of the laser printer. The ship's navigator points out the two tropical depressions that are on the point of becoming cyclones. Our route traces a neat line between the two; small wonder we have had such an ordeal! Back down in the junior officers mess we're surrounded by the crew who grill us both on how we came to be here, and also the standard of English Cricket. Now this is what we had been looking forward to, the Ozzies, the people with whom we share so much, and yet who are on the opposite side of the world to us, and who can't stop beating us at Cricket!

Epilogue

As we came alongside in Northern Command Naval Base Darwin, the customs officers were ready for us. As we explained how we had come to be entering Australia in such an unconventional way, the two officers looked at each other. 'A 51ft ketch, on Dundee Beach.....it went down last night'. In the pit of our stomachs Dean and I both felt dreadfully ill. Like a hard punch to the stomach, our wind was taken from us. As we sat together wondering what on earth had happened the next piece of news filtered through that all seven on board were safe and well. We couldn't help but wonder though quite what disaster had unfolded back there to mean that the boat had sunk.

Probably looking somewhat punch-drunk, Dean and I were taken under the wing of one Captain David Bergman of the Northern Command Army. Brought back to his house we sat, and we sat, not really able to gather our thoughts properly. We looked at our one bag and the handful of belongings that had come ashore safely with us. 3 Hindi Pop CD's, Dean's make up, a reading book, and a few grubby clothes. We sat and looked at each other in our Navy Boilersuits. Now what would we do?
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KuKuKaChu: dangerously too sophisticated

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#85503 - 04 Sep 08 07:45 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: KuKuKaChu]
Dilli Offline
Pujangga Besar

Registered: 26 Feb 06
Posts: 8044
Loc: Nearest Bar
Something tells me that you really dont like this guy....
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#85504 - 04 Sep 08 07:47 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Dilli]
KuKuKaChu Moderator Offline
Pooh Bah

Registered: 09 Oct 05
Posts: 10790
Loc: Centre of the Universe
make up your own mind. wink i'm just cutting and pasting ...
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#85507 - 04 Sep 08 08:21 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: KuKuKaChu]
KuKuKaChu Moderator Offline
Pooh Bah

Registered: 09 Oct 05
Posts: 10790
Loc: Centre of the Universe
news clipping from Darwin newspaper about "Captain" "Lawrence's" ill-fated journey to north Australia:

http://www.humanpower.freeserve.co.uk/darwin%20press.htm
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#85508 - 04 Sep 08 09:35 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: KuKuKaChu]
Vulgarian Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 25 Apr 08
Posts: 2369
Loc: Jakarta
tl;dr
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#85529 - 04 Sep 08 11:55 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Vulgarian]
Piss Salon Offline
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Registered: 27 Jun 06
Posts: 4039
Loc: Jakpus
One of the underlying themes in the stories above is greed. Who the fuck buys silver coins and expects a 100 percent return on investment in a year. A fool and his money ...
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#86834 - 30 Sep 08 23:18 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Piss Salon]
JakartaLinks Offline
Member+

Registered: 07 Jul 08
Posts: 52
Loc: Indonesia, Jakarta
gramaticly correcy smile Piss Solan
LOL
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#89705 - 18 Nov 08 16:10 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: JakartaLinks]
AlvinHosanna Offline
Member

Registered: 24 Jul 08
Posts: 25
Loc: Singapore
another "get rich scheme" busted in Colombia.
http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5gOl1IC_1tIR4nxQ0hN_S2cUkAJRA

Unfortunately took advantage of the poor!
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#89799 - 20 Nov 08 05:41 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: AlvinHosanna]
kuncung Offline
Member+

Registered: 17 Nov 08
Posts: 100
Loc: Home sweet home
ew.. what an ugly guy /throwup
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nyeh.

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#89817 - 20 Nov 08 07:39 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: AlvinHosanna]
Dilli Offline
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Registered: 26 Feb 06
Posts: 8044
Loc: Nearest Bar
Quoting: AlvinHosanna

Unfortunately took advantage of the poor!


Cant be that poor, one guy invested $8,700
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#90706 - 29 Nov 08 20:17 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: KuKuKaChu]
KuKuKaChu Moderator Offline
Pooh Bah

Registered: 09 Oct 05
Posts: 10790
Loc: Centre of the Universe
watch out! Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine aka Bellefonte is back, advertising in The Jakarta Post today:



don't say you weren't warned!
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#90716 - 29 Nov 08 21:34 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: KuKuKaChu]
L. Bellefontaine Offline
Member

Registered: 03 Sep 08
Posts: 17
Loc: Bali
Quoting: KuKuKaChu
watch out! Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine aka Bellefonte is back, advertising in The Jakarta Post today:



don't say you weren't warned!


look man... I really hoped i'd heard the last from you, but once again you subject me to more slander and insinuations. Just lay off, ok buddy. Or it's gonna be ting-a-ling-a-ling to my attorneys. Understood ?????

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#90717 - 29 Nov 08 21:37 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: KuKuKaChu]
Polisi Cepek Offline
Member*

Registered: 17 Mar 07
Posts: 809
Loc: Di tengah hutan
This is fucked up. Apologies if I'm mistaken, but it looks like The Jakarta Post is allowing people to post adverts using the same font as their regular text, in a box so it looks like an article. There ought to be a different (non house style) font and a little note that it's a paid advert.
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#90729 - 30 Nov 08 07:25 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Polisi Cepek]
Dilli Offline
Pujangga Besar

Registered: 26 Feb 06
Posts: 8044
Loc: Nearest Bar
In the UK they are called Advertorials and are clearly marked as such.
_________________________
Menace to Sobriety


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#90730 - 30 Nov 08 07:35 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: L. Bellefontaine]
KuKuKaChu Moderator Offline
Pooh Bah

Registered: 09 Oct 05
Posts: 10790
Loc: Centre of the Universe
Quoting: L. Bellefontaine
look man... I really hoped i'd heard the last from you, but once again you subject me to more slander and insinuations. Just lay off, ok buddy. Or it's gonna be ting-a-ling-a-ling to my attorneys. Understood ?????

go ahead! make my day!
_________________________
KuKuKaChu: dangerously too sophisticated

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#90734 - 30 Nov 08 08:55 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Dilli]
kenyeung Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 16 Apr 07
Posts: 2374
Loc: Indonesia
Quoting: Dilli
In the UK they are called Advertorials and are clearly marked as such.


In Spain they are called Publirreportaje and are clearly marked by an image of a penis in the headline.

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#90737 - 30 Nov 08 09:31 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: KuKuKaChu]
fred Offline
Member*

Registered: 26 Nov 08
Posts: 743
Loc: here and there
Quoting: KuKuKaChu
watch out! Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine aka Bellefonte is back, advertising in The Jakarta Post today:



don't say you weren't warned!


This is auful. You take the good name of an honest businessman just trying to earn a living and wipe it in the dirt.
Still I'm sure that he will sue you for every penny you have and you will stop slandering this poor man.

I'm sure that he is nothing to do with this bloke. grin

http://the.honoluluadvertiser.com/article/2007/Apr/16/ln/FP704160348.html
Quote:

ert Ho and Carol Comeau weren't pleased to learn that Barry Bellefontaine, a Honolulu investment adviser who took their money and skipped town nearly 12 years ago, is now selling luxury homes in Bali, Indonesia, and serving as president of the local tennis club.

After Bellefontaine and his wife sailed off in a 50-foot-yacht in July 1995, his investment company went belly-up, owing $4.2 million to Ho, Comeau and about 90 other investors and creditors.

_________________________
I have never been convicted of any crime involving sheep.

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#90740 - 30 Nov 08 10:00 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: fred]
KuKuKaChu Moderator Offline
Pooh Bah

Registered: 09 Oct 05
Posts: 10790
Loc: Centre of the Universe
Quoting: fred
This is auful. You take the good name of an honest businessman just trying to earn a living and wipe it in the dirt.

indeed, bazza "lawrence" bellafonte/bellefontaine is a founding member of the South Bali Legitimate Businessman's Association.
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KuKuKaChu: dangerously too sophisticated

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#90743 - 30 Nov 08 10:15 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: KuKuKaChu]
fred Offline
Member*

Registered: 26 Nov 08
Posts: 743
Loc: here and there
Quoting: KuKuKaChu
Quoting: fred
This is auful. You take the good name of an honest businessman just trying to earn a living and wipe it in the dirt.

indeed, bazza "lawrence" bellafonte/bellefontaine is a founding member of the South Bali Legitimate Businessman's Association.


Legitimate? Sound like right dodgy ILlegitimate to me. grin
Just watch. Some bastard will tell the golf club about him.
_________________________
I have never been convicted of any crime involving sheep.

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#90744 - 30 Nov 08 10:21 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: fred]
KuKuKaChu Moderator Offline
Pooh Bah

Registered: 09 Oct 05
Posts: 10790
Loc: Centre of the Universe
Quoting: fred
Just watch. Some bastard will tell the golf club about him.

tennis, if you please.
_________________________
KuKuKaChu: dangerously too sophisticated

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#90747 - 30 Nov 08 10:32 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: KuKuKaChu]
fred Offline
Member*

Registered: 26 Nov 08
Posts: 743
Loc: here and there
Very sorry. I was:

asleep while typing
Pissed at the time
High on illegal something
Shagging
thinking about shagging
looking at a sheep and the one above.
_________________________
I have never been convicted of any crime involving sheep.

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#90763 - 30 Nov 08 11:55 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: fred]
L. Bellefontaine Offline
Member

Registered: 03 Sep 08
Posts: 17
Loc: Bali
Listen Mr I'm a friggin DJ. I'll have you know that neither I, nor my attorneys, take kindly to your using unsubstantiated claims to defame me. I'll have you know that i was cleared, in absentia, of any wrongdoing in Hawaii and am a simple man trying to forge a living in peace in Bali. I don't feel it necessary to rake up mud about you or anyone else. Believe me, this website, its administrators and even its casual users are NOT immune to actions (legal and otherwise) that i might choose to take. Once again, lay off me all. And for those who can see through all this petty backstabbing bullshit initiated against me on this site, feel free to send me a private message should you want any information about property in Bali.


Edited by L. Bellefontaine (30 Nov 08 12:11)

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#90765 - 30 Nov 08 11:59 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: L. Bellefontaine]
Dilli Offline
Pujangga Besar

Registered: 26 Feb 06
Posts: 8044
Loc: Nearest Bar
PM on it's way asshole....
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Menace to Sobriety


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#90766 - 30 Nov 08 12:01 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: L. Bellefontaine]
Marmalade Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 18 Apr 08
Posts: 2471
Loc: Jak
Wow! A blanket warning. Fuck off Belle-end!
_________________________
JakartaRestaurantReviews.com


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#90768 - 30 Nov 08 12:04 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Marmalade]
viperaberushitam Offline
Member**

Registered: 31 Oct 07
Posts: 1407
Loc: Somebody's watching me......
Quoting: Marmalade
Wow! A blanket warning. Fuck off Belle-end!



Yes, it is very threatening coming from a Canadian CM.......
_________________________
This is one of those "Half full, Half empt..shit I just spilled the glass in my lap" observations, isn't it?

The only Faith that people really have to lose, is faith in themselves...........

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#90769 - 30 Nov 08 12:04 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Marmalade]
Vulgarian Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 25 Apr 08
Posts: 2369
Loc: Jakarta
Surely this is not the man himself? Look at his first post:

Go Fuck yourself Kukukachu. You've been spreading slander about me for far too long and all because of one night in that Saigon titty bar. I'll see you in court buddy boy.
_________________________
I like the dog. If he can't eat it, or fuck it, he pisses on it. I can get behind that.

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#90770 - 30 Nov 08 12:05 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Vulgarian]
Dilli Offline
Pujangga Besar

Registered: 26 Feb 06
Posts: 8044
Loc: Nearest Bar
snigger
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Menace to Sobriety


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#90773 - 30 Nov 08 12:07 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Dilli]
viperaberushitam Offline
Member**

Registered: 31 Oct 07
Posts: 1407
Loc: Somebody's watching me......
Seems like the bitch Womb is up to her old tricks......
_________________________
This is one of those "Half full, Half empt..shit I just spilled the glass in my lap" observations, isn't it?

The only Faith that people really have to lose, is faith in themselves...........

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#90774 - 30 Nov 08 12:08 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: viperaberushitam]
viperaberushitam Offline
Member**

Registered: 31 Oct 07
Posts: 1407
Loc: Somebody's watching me......
Either that or Lawrence knows Kuku quite well.........
_________________________
This is one of those "Half full, Half empt..shit I just spilled the glass in my lap" observations, isn't it?

The only Faith that people really have to lose, is faith in themselves...........

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#90776 - 30 Nov 08 12:08 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: L. Bellefontaine]
Polisi Cepek Offline
Member*

Registered: 17 Mar 07
Posts: 809
Loc: Di tengah hutan
Very cute use of the word 'obtain' in the advert above: "...new legal methods for foreigners to obtain Bali properties". Treading a fairly fine line with bullshit there, seeing as how Indonesian law clearly prohibits foreigners obtaining property here.

Please feel free to post some proof of your non-involvement in the loss of people's investments.

Not sure we need to be worried about legal threats from a man who can't even spell "attorney". But go ahead and have a try, I'm sure my colleagues in the Supreme Court would enjoy hearing your case.
_________________________
"Some people think I've been flogging my own sausage," he joked.

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#90778 - 30 Nov 08 12:09 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: viperaberushitam]
Vulgarian Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 25 Apr 08
Posts: 2369
Loc: Jakarta
I suspected dilli, but the correctly spelled 'too' threw me off the scent.
_________________________
I like the dog. If he can't eat it, or fuck it, he pisses on it. I can get behind that.

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#90779 - 30 Nov 08 12:11 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Vulgarian]
Dilli Offline
Pujangga Besar

Registered: 26 Feb 06
Posts: 8044
Loc: Nearest Bar
dilli Not guilty of/off anything in this regard
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Menace to Sobriety


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#90780 - 30 Nov 08 12:11 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Vulgarian]
Polisi Cepek Offline
Member*

Registered: 17 Mar 07
Posts: 809
Loc: Di tengah hutan
Quoting: Vulgarian
Surely this is not the man himself? Look at his first post:

Go Fuck yourself Kukukachu. You've been spreading slander about me for far too long and all because of one night in that Saigon titty bar. I'll see you in court buddy boy.


Ah, we're being wound up are we? I suppose his appearance online was too good to be true, no-one could be that big an idiot. Nor use that picture of themselves.
_________________________
"Some people think I've been flogging my own sausage," he joked.

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#90782 - 30 Nov 08 12:12 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Vulgarian]
Marmalade Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 18 Apr 08
Posts: 2471
Loc: Jak
and the of/off minefield!
_________________________
JakartaRestaurantReviews.com


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#90788 - 30 Nov 08 12:21 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Polisi Cepek]
L. Bellefontaine Offline
Member

Registered: 03 Sep 08
Posts: 17
Loc: Bali
Quoting: Vulgarian
Surely this is not the man himself? Look at his first post:

Go Fuck yourself Kukukachu. You've been spreading slander about me for far too long and all because of one night in that Saigon titty bar. I'll see you in court buddy boy.


Look. I'm the first to admit that the post quoted above was written in anger and was wholly inappropraite. Unlike many others, I'm very quick to acknowledge my mistakes. But take it from me, the essence of that post is completely true.

Quoting: Polisi Cepek
Very cute use of the word 'obtain' in the advert above: "...new legal methods for foreigners to obtain Bali properties". Treading a fairly fine line with bullshit there, seeing as how Indonesian law clearly prohibits foreigners obtaining property here.

Please feel free to post some proof of your non-involvement in the loss of people's investments.

Not sure we need to be worried about legal threats from a man who can't even spell "attorney". But go ahead and have a try, I'm sure my colleagues in the Supreme Court would enjoy hearing your case.


As for this, I cannot see what problem there is with my spelling but it is this kind of petty issue which is pretty typical of people on this website. A bit of a mob mentality I'd say. Has anyone taken a step back, done a bit of research and formed a considered opinion. No, it's more like 'here's a successful guy. Let's go after him'. Pretty shallow gentlemen.
Also, i feel no need to furnish any of you with any proof of involvement, non-involvement or otherwise as regards to my life and business dealings. The burden of proof does not lie with me. You Sir, feel free to publish any proof you discover against me. I'm living and working here quite legitimately and you are welcome to investigate that. As for your threat about the supreme court justices. I feel this is fancy thinking on you part. A foreigner here, who considers them his 'colleagues'. Tell it to the next sucker.

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#90790 - 30 Nov 08 12:23 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: L. Bellefontaine]
Dilli Offline
Pujangga Besar

Registered: 26 Feb 06
Posts: 8044
Loc: Nearest Bar
snigger snigger snigger
_________________________
Menace to Sobriety


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#90792 - 30 Nov 08 12:29 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Polisi Cepek]
viperaberushitam Offline
Member**

Registered: 31 Oct 07
Posts: 1407
Loc: Somebody's watching me......
Quoting: Polisi Cepek
Very cute use of the word 'obtain' in the advert above: "...new legal methods for foreigners to obtain Bali properties". Treading a fairly fine line with bullshit there, seeing as how Indonesian law clearly prohibits foreigners obtaining property here.

Please feel free to post some proof of your non-involvement in the loss of people's investments.

Not sure we need to be worried about legal threats from a man who can't even spell "attorney". But go ahead and have a try, I'm sure my colleagues in the Supreme Court would enjoy hearing your case.




The new laws have been made dubiously by the big dogs in the Bali administration. They have in Bali 99 yr leases for expats for land, but we all know that the only legal land laws in Indonesia come from Jakarta
_________________________
This is one of those "Half full, Half empt..shit I just spilled the glass in my lap" observations, isn't it?

The only Faith that people really have to lose, is faith in themselves...........

Top
#90793 - 30 Nov 08 12:29 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: L. Bellefontaine]
Vulgarian Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 25 Apr 08
Posts: 2369
Loc: Jakarta
Quoting: L. Bellefontaine
Quoting: Vulgarian
Surely this is not the man himself? Look at his first post:

Go Fuck yourself Kukukachu. You've been spreading slander about me for far too long and all because of one night in that Saigon titty bar. I'll see you in court buddy boy.


Look. I'm the first to admit that the post quoted above was written in anger and was wholly inappropraite. But take it from me, the essence of that post is completely true.


Please, please, please tell us the Kukukachu Saigon titty bar story.
_________________________
I like the dog. If he can't eat it, or fuck it, he pisses on it. I can get behind that.

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#90794 - 30 Nov 08 12:37 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Vulgarian]
L. Bellefontaine Offline
Member

Registered: 03 Sep 08
Posts: 17
Loc: Bali
ask the man himself. Just mention Club 6B and the name YOKO...but be sure to do it to his face so you can see the blush of guilt

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#90795 - 30 Nov 08 12:39 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: L. Bellefontaine]
Vulgarian Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 25 Apr 08
Posts: 2369
Loc: Jakarta
Yoko Ono? I know Ku's old, but...
_________________________
I like the dog. If he can't eat it, or fuck it, he pisses on it. I can get behind that.

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#90796 - 30 Nov 08 12:46 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Vulgarian]
L. Bellefontaine Offline
Member

Registered: 03 Sep 08
Posts: 17
Loc: Bali
Quoting: Vulgarian
Yoko Ono? I know Ku's old, but...


My friend, being fatuous is unlikely to impress me

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#90798 - 30 Nov 08 12:54 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: L. Bellefontaine]
Marmalade Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 18 Apr 08
Posts: 2471
Loc: Jak
I reiterate. Fuck off Belle-end. Don't go making blanket threats and then wondering why a mob turns against you.
_________________________
JakartaRestaurantReviews.com


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#90799 - 30 Nov 08 12:59 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Marmalade]
Vulgarian Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 25 Apr 08
Posts: 2369
Loc: Jakarta
Was it anything like this?

_________________________
I like the dog. If he can't eat it, or fuck it, he pisses on it. I can get behind that.

Top
#90807 - 30 Nov 08 13:25 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: L. Bellefontaine]
KuKuKaChu Moderator Offline
Pooh Bah

Registered: 09 Oct 05
Posts: 10790
Loc: Centre of the Universe
Quoting: L. Bellefontaine
ask the man himself. Just mention Club 6B and the name YOKO...but be sure to do it to his face so you can see the blush of guilt
tripping
_________________________
KuKuKaChu: dangerously too sophisticated

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#90808 - 30 Nov 08 13:26 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: KuKuKaChu]
Vulgarian Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 25 Apr 08
Posts: 2369
Loc: Jakarta
Rainbow blush? YOKO WAS A MAN!
_________________________
I like the dog. If he can't eat it, or fuck it, he pisses on it. I can get behind that.

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#90810 - 30 Nov 08 13:49 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Vulgarian]
The Prisoner Offline
Member+/-

Registered: 04 Nov 06
Posts: 151
Loc: United Kingdom
Got to say this, but I'm getting rather bored now.
_________________________
Quantum et glorificum est caulium consecaretur facere sodoma
How great and glorious it is to commit illegal sex acts for coleslaw
Or
Dulce et decorum est pro sodomy coleslaw
It is sweet and proper to fuck coleslaw up the arse

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#90811 - 30 Nov 08 13:57 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: The Prisoner]
Dilli Offline
Pujangga Besar

Registered: 26 Feb 06
Posts: 8044
Loc: Nearest Bar
You're married, you can do "things" with too your wife
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Menace to Sobriety


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#90819 - 30 Nov 08 20:23 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: L. Bellefontaine]
fred Offline
Member*

Registered: 26 Nov 08
Posts: 743
Loc: here and there
Quoting: L. Bellefontaine
Listen Mr I'm a friggin DJ. I'll have you know that neither I, nor my attorneys, take kindly to your using unsubstantiated claims to defame me. I'll have you know that i was cleared, in absentia, of any wrongdoing in Hawaii ..............
Bullshit ad nausium..............
feel free to send me a private message should you want any information about property in Bali.


Last first. I may be a little gila on the edges and possibly enjoy the company of sheep from time to time but I'm not so fucking daft as to deal with a naughty little fibber who has run away with who knows how much of other people's cash.
Quote:
Bali is like Hawai'i 30 years ago.

Sounds dangerously close to being like it 12 years ago when some bastard bogged off with all the cash.
Unless of course the honolulu advertiser (substantiated claims) have it all wrong and you are really a sweet charitable old bastard just mis-understood and the statute of limitations just saved you the bother of having to prove you did nothing wrong.





Sweet charitable bastard or just bastard?

Anyway there am I being all nice to you saying I'm sure that the link was nothing to do with you and you go around trying to frighten me with a law suit.
Now those dodgy suits you are wearing in the photos scare me. Christ, if I ever wore a pimp suit like that I'd shop myself in to the fashion police.
_________________________
I have never been convicted of any crime involving sheep.

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#90820 - 30 Nov 08 20:26 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Vulgarian]
fred Offline
Member*

Registered: 26 Nov 08
Posts: 743
Loc: here and there
Quoting: Vulgarian
Was it anything like this?


Now that's def not charitable. grin
_________________________
I have never been convicted of any crime involving sheep.

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#90841 - 01 Dec 08 09:28 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Polisi Cepek]
BULGAR Offline
Member

Registered: 30 Nov 08
Posts: 3
Loc: bulgaria
Quoting: Polisi Cepek
Very cute use of the word 'obtain' in the advert above: "...new legal methods for foreigners to obtain Bali properties". Treading a fairly fine line with bullshit there, seeing as how Indonesian law clearly prohibits foreigners obtaining property here.

Please feel free to post some proof of your non-involvement in the loss of people's investments.

Not sure we need to be worried about legal threats from a man who can't even spell "attorney". But go ahead and have a try, I'm sure my colleagues in the Supreme Court would enjoy hearing your case.


I thought that this man used to work for a newspaper once, why he make bad spelling?

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#90866 - 01 Dec 08 11:32 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: BULGAR]
KuKuKaChu Moderator Offline
Pooh Bah

Registered: 09 Oct 05
Posts: 10790
Loc: Centre of the Universe
Quoting: BULGAR
I thought that this man used to work for a newspaper once, why he make bad spelling?

why you make bad foreign accent?
_________________________
KuKuKaChu: dangerously too sophisticated

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#90869 - 01 Dec 08 11:42 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: KuKuKaChu]
Roy's Hair Offline
Pujangga Besar

Registered: 08 Nov 06
Posts: 3974
Loc: jakarta
I'm the featured member. Kuku's a private club, he can only admit one member at a time.
_________________________
Chinese like more traditional patterns on their ring.

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#93274 - 09 Jan 09 17:46 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Roy's Hair]
SWF Offline
Member

Registered: 13 Sep 08
Posts: 11
Loc: holland
duuhhh cant post SWF anymore ?


Edited by SWF (09 Jan 09 17:49)

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#93289 - 10 Jan 09 01:07 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Roy's Hair]
Piss Salon Offline
Pujangga Besar

Registered: 27 Jun 06
Posts: 4039
Loc: Jakpus
Quoting: Roy's Hair
I'm the featured member. Kuku's a private club, he can only admit one member at a time.


Two if you stick one in his mouth.
_________________________
place within us love that truly gives, tenderness that truly unites, self-offering that tells the truth and does not deceive, forgiveness that truly receives, loving physical union that welcomes

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#93939 - 16 Jan 09 17:50 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: KuKuKaChu]
bandersnatch Offline
Member+

Registered: 10 Dec 08
Posts: 33
Loc: dubai
A Bule crook living in Bali? Don't you mean one of the many Bule crooks living in Bali

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#93940 - 16 Jan 09 18:17 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: bandersnatch]
L. Bellefontaine Offline
Member

Registered: 03 Sep 08
Posts: 17
Loc: Bali
Quoting: bandersnatch
A Bule crook living in Bali? Don't you mean one of the many Bule crooks living in Bali


Look bandersnatch. I'd hold your tongue if i were you boy. First you started on my friend and colleague Mr James and now you're starting on me. I'm not in the business of making threats son, but if you start looking for trouble, you might just find it. You have now been spoken to.

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#93946 - 16 Jan 09 22:01 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: L. Bellefontaine]
fred Offline
Member*

Registered: 26 Nov 08
Posts: 743
Loc: here and there
Boy? bet that goes down well.

Careful banders some bent fuck may be wanting to take your arse's virginity.

<awaits threat from dickhead with seriously dodgy past>
_________________________
I have never been convicted of any crime involving sheep.

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#93962 - 17 Jan 09 06:50 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: L. Bellefontaine]
bandersnatch Offline
Member+

Registered: 10 Dec 08
Posts: 33
Loc: dubai
Listen, Lawrence, or may I call you Larry? I happen to know that you were a contributing author in Mala James's seminal reference book:"Expat Embezzlement for fun and profit." ( Winner of the "Pultheotherone Prize" for best non-fiction by a member of BIWA). Your attempt at hiding behind that "nom-de-plume" of Lazlo Beautiful-Fountain fooled no-one.

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#94008 - 17 Jan 09 15:59 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: bandersnatch]
fred Offline
Member*

Registered: 26 Nov 08
Posts: 743
Loc: here and there
Quoting: bandersnatch
Listen, Lawrence, or may I call you Larry? I happen to know that you were a contributing author in Mala James's seminal reference book:"Expat Embezzlement for fun and profit." ( Winner of the "Pultheotherone Prize" for best non-fiction by a member of BIWA). Your attempt at hiding behind that "nom-de-plume" of Lazlo Beautiful-Fountain fooled no-one.


So you're a fan of his then. grin
_________________________
I have never been convicted of any crime involving sheep.

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#94009 - 17 Jan 09 16:14 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: fred]
L. Bellefontaine Offline
Member

Registered: 03 Sep 08
Posts: 17
Loc: Bali
Quoting: fred
Quoting: bandersnatch
Listen, Lawrence, or may I call you Larry? I happen to know that you were a contributing author in Mala James's seminal reference book:"Expat Embezzlement for fun and profit." ( Winner of the "Pultheotherone Prize" for best non-fiction by a member of BIWA). Your attempt at hiding behind that "nom-de-plume" of Lazlo Beautiful-Fountain fooled no-one.


So you're a fan of his then. grin


DO NOT...DO NOT CROSS THE LINE TOO MR FRED...YOU TOO ARE NOT IMMUNE TO THE INFLUENCE MY FRIENDS HERE WIELD.

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#94014 - 17 Jan 09 16:26 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: L. Bellefontaine]
KuKuKaChu Moderator Offline
Pooh Bah

Registered: 09 Oct 05
Posts: 10790
Loc: Centre of the Universe
Quoting: L. Bellefontaine
DO NOT...DO NOT CROSS THE LINE TOO MR FRED...YOU TOO ARE NOT IMMUNE TO THE INFLUENCE MY FRIENDS HERE WIELD.

Blank
_________________________
KuKuKaChu: dangerously too sophisticated

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#94018 - 17 Jan 09 16:52 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: L. Bellefontaine]
fred Offline
Member*

Registered: 26 Nov 08
Posts: 743
Loc: here and there
Quoting: L. Bellefontaine
Quoting: fred
Quoting: bandersnatch
Listen, Lawrence, or may I call you Larry? I happen to know that you were a contributing author in Mala James's seminal reference book:"Expat Embezzlement for fun and profit." ( Winner of the "Pultheotherone Prize" for best non-fiction by a member of BIWA). Your attempt at hiding behind that "nom-de-plume" of Lazlo Beautiful-Fountain fooled no-one.


So you're a fan of his then. grin


DO NOT...DO NOT CROSS THE LINE TOO MR FRED...YOU TOO ARE NOT IMMUNE TO THE INFLUENCE MY FRIENDS HERE WIELD.


I'm sorry, really sorry, so sorry.
In fact I'm fucking sorry.

Please don't do anything bad to me sir. I've just shit my pants and now my wife is nagging me about having to wash them.
I'm going to look like boy George on a loose arse day on the way home.
Again I would like to offer my sincere appollllobogies to you for any hurt I may have caused you your thinking I was suggesting you may be in any way corrupt or a bent bastard who is likely to be in the papers in the next couple of years for pissing off with a load of your customer's cash. blush

I now know that the bloke in Hawaii was not being hunted by 5-0 , the tax bods FBI or any fucker else and that the pimp suited gentleman was, in reality, an honest businessman just a bit misunderstood.
_________________________
I have never been convicted of any crime involving sheep.

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#94019 - 17 Jan 09 16:54 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: fred]
Dilli Offline
Pujangga Besar

Registered: 26 Feb 06
Posts: 8044
Loc: Nearest Bar
snigger

Do what I would have done...tell him to fuck off!
_________________________
Menace to Sobriety


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#94021 - 17 Jan 09 17:05 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Dilli]
fred Offline
Member*

Registered: 26 Nov 08
Posts: 743
Loc: here and there
Quoting: Dilli
snigger

Do what I would have done...tell him to fuck off!


I dare not. Maybe he'll do something very naughty to me.
Damm, shit myself again.
_________________________
I have never been convicted of any crime involving sheep.

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#94023 - 17 Jan 09 20:21 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: fred]
Polisi Cepek Offline
Member*

Registered: 17 Mar 07
Posts: 809
Loc: Di tengah hutan
I call shenanigans on the fake Mr Bellefontaine persona. Hands up, who is it?
_________________________
"Some people think I've been flogging my own sausage," he joked.

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#94024 - 17 Jan 09 21:00 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Polisi Cepek]
KuKuKaChu Moderator Offline
Pooh Bah

Registered: 09 Oct 05
Posts: 10790
Loc: Centre of the Universe
there is an unbeliever amongst us!!
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KuKuKaChu: dangerously too sophisticated

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#94026 - 18 Jan 09 01:42 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: KuKuKaChu]
Marmalade Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 18 Apr 08
Posts: 2471
Loc: Jak
PC, stop dissenting and believe that JakChat is real?
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JakartaRestaurantReviews.com


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#94027 - 18 Jan 09 01:49 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Marmalade]
Marmalade Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 18 Apr 08
Posts: 2471
Loc: Jak
C'mon. We are all small pixies with magical charms.
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JakartaRestaurantReviews.com


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#94028 - 18 Jan 09 01:54 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Marmalade]
Vulgarian Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 25 Apr 08
Posts: 2369
Loc: Jakarta
_________________________
I like the dog. If he can't eat it, or fuck it, he pisses on it. I can get behind that.

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#94029 - 18 Jan 09 07:42 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Vulgarian]
bandersnatch Offline
Member+

Registered: 10 Dec 08
Posts: 33
Loc: dubai
I'm crapping my pants too. I was thinking of moving to greener pastures but.....


Attachments
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#94087 - 18 Jan 09 13:02 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Vulgarian]
Marmalade Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 18 Apr 08
Posts: 2471
Loc: Jak
I'd like someone to take my limited funds cynically. Any ideas?
_________________________
JakartaRestaurantReviews.com


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#94089 - 18 Jan 09 13:06 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Marmalade]
Dilli Offline
Pujangga Besar

Registered: 26 Feb 06
Posts: 8044
Loc: Nearest Bar
What worries me most about the credit crunch, is that if one of my cheques is returned stamped "insufficient funds", I won't know whether that refers to mine or the bank's.
_________________________
Menace to Sobriety


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#94100 - 18 Jan 09 13:23 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Dilli]
Marmalade Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 18 Apr 08
Posts: 2471
Loc: Jak
:slow hand clap:
_________________________
JakartaRestaurantReviews.com


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#96721 - 12 Mar 09 22:03 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Dilli]
luludanlili Offline
Member+

Registered: 09 Mar 09
Posts: 37
Loc: jakarta, indonesia
why somebody, administrator or anyone banned him to join the forum? Seem he continue offering villas
_________________________
-lubang di dalam hati-

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#96798 - 13 Mar 09 16:28 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: luludanlili]
fred Offline
Member*

Registered: 26 Nov 08
Posts: 743
Loc: here and there
Quoting: luludanlili
why somebody, administrator or anyone banned him to join the forum? Seem he continue offering villas


Can't ban him. One day I may go mad and want some bent fuck to pinch all my cash.
Where the hell else would I go if he was banned?

I suppose I could donate it to a couple of the posters on here to get pissed off their faces with.
_________________________
I have never been convicted of any crime involving sheep.

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#96849 - 14 Mar 09 22:34 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Piss Salon]
Polisi Cepek Offline
Member*

Registered: 17 Mar 07
Posts: 809
Loc: Di tengah hutan
Quoting: Piss Salon
One of the underlying themes in the stories above is greed. Who the fuck buys silver coins and expects a 100 percent return on investment in a year. A fool and his money ...


The New York Review of Books
Volume 56, Number 5
Issue cover-dated
March 26, 2009
Capitalism Beyond the Crisis
By Amartya Sen
1.
2008 was a year of crises. First, we had a food crisis,
particularly threatening to poor consumers, especially in
Africa. Along with that came a record increase in oil prices,
threatening all oil-importing countries. Finally, rather
suddenly in the fall, came the global economic downturn, and it
is now gathering speed at a frightening rate. The year 2009
seems likely to offer a sharp intensification of the downturn,
and many economists are anticipating a full-scale depression,
perhaps even one as large as in the 1930s. While substantial
fortunes have suffered steep declines, the people most affected
are those who were already worst off.
The question that arises most forcefully now concerns the nature
of capitalism and whether it needs to be changed. Some defenders
of unfettered capitalism who resist change are convinced that
capitalism is being blamed too much for short-term economic
problems—problems they variously attribute to bad governance
(for example by the Bush administration) and the bad behavior of
some individuals (or what John McCain described during the
presidential campaign as "the greed of Wall Street"). Others do,
however, see truly serious defects in the existing economic
arrangements and want to reform them, looking for an alternative
approach that is increasingly being called "new capitalism."
The idea of old and new capitalism played an energizing part at
a symposium called "New World, New Capitalism" held in Paris in
January and hosted by the French president Nicolas Sarkozy and
the former British prime minister Tony Blair, both of whom made
eloquent presentations on the need for change. So did German
Chancellor Angela Merkel, who talked about the old German idea
of a "social market"—one restrained by a mixture of
consensus-building policies—as a possible blueprint for new
capitalism (though Germany has not done much better in the
recent crisis than other market economies). NYRB / Season of
Migration
Ideas about changing the organization of society in the long run
are clearly needed, quite apart from strategies for dealing with
an immediate crisis. I would separate out three questions from
the many that can be raised. First, do we really need some kind
of "new capitalism" rather than an economic system that is not
monolithic, draws on a variety of institutions chosen
pragmatically, and is based on social values that we can defend
ethically? Should we search for a new capitalism or for a "new
world"—to use the other term mentioned at the Paris meeting—that
would take a different form?
The second question concerns the kind of economics that is
needed today, especially in light of the present economic
crisis. How do we assess what is taught and championed among
academic economists as a guide to economic policy—including the
revival of Keynesian thought in recent months as the crisis has
grown fierce? More particularly, what does the present economic
crisis tell us about the institutions and priorities to look
for? Third, in addition to working our way toward a better
assessment of what long-term changes are needed, we have to
think—and think fast—about how to get out of the present crisis
with as little damage as possible.
2.
What are the special characteristics that make a system
indubitably capitalist—old or new? If the present capitalist
economic system is to be reformed, what would make the end
result a new capitalism, rather than something else? It seems to
be generally assumed that relying on markets for economic
transactions is a necessary condition for an economy to be
identified as capitalist. In a similar way, dependence on the
profit motive and on individual rewards based on private
ownership are seen as archetypal features of capitalism.
However, if these are necessary requirements, are the economic
systems we currently have, for example, in Europe and America,
genuinely capitalist?
All affluent countries in the world—those in Europe, as well as
the US, Canada, Japan, Singapore, South Korea, Australia, and
others—have, for quite some time now, depended partly on
transactions and other payments that occur largely outside
markets. These include unemployment benefits, public pensions,
other features of social security, and the provision of
education, health care, and a variety of other services
distributed through nonmarket arrangements. The economic
entitlements connected with such services are not based on
private ownership and property rights.
Also, the market economy has depended for its own working not
only on maximizing profits but also on many other activities,
such as maintaining public security and supplying public
services—some of which have taken people well beyond an economy
driven only by profit. The creditable performance of the
so-called capitalist system, when things moved forward, drew on
a combination of institutions—publicly funded education, medical
care, and mass transportation are just a few of many—that went
much beyond relying only on a profit-maximizing market economy
and on personal entitlements confined to private ownership.
Underlying this issue is a more basic question: whether
capitalism is a term that is of particular use today. The idea
of capitalism did in fact have an important role historically,
but by now that usefulness may well be fairly exhausted.
For example, the pioneering works of Adam Smith in the
eighteenth century showed the usefulness and dynamism of the
market economy, and why—and particularly how—that dynamism
worked. Smith's investigation provided an illuminating diagnosis
of the workings of the market just when that dynamism was
powerfully emerging. The contribution that The Wealth of
Nations, published in 1776, made to the understanding of what
came to be called capitalism was monumental. Smith showed how
the freeing of trade can very often be extremely helpful in
generating economic prosperity through specialization in
production and division of labor and in making good use of
economies of large scale.
Those lessons remain deeply relevant even today (it is
interesting that the impressive and highly sophisticated
analytical work on international trade for which Paul Krugman
received the latest Nobel award in economics was closely linked
to Smith's far-reaching insights of more than 230 years ago).
The economic analyses that followed those early expositions of
markets and the use of capital in the eighteenth century have
succeeded in solidly establishing the market system in the
corpus of mainstream economics.
However, even as the positive contributions of capitalism
through market processes were being clarified and explicated,
its negative sides were also becoming clear—often to the very
same analysts. While a number of socialist critics, most notably
Karl Marx, influentially made a case for censuring and
ultimately supplanting capitalism, the huge limitations of
relying entirely on the market economy and the profit motive
were also clear enough even to Adam Smith. Indeed, early
advocates of the use of markets, including Smith, did not take
the pure market mechanism to be a freestanding performer of
excellence, nor did they take the profit motive to be all that
is needed.
Even though people seek trade because of self-interest (nothing
more than self-interest is needed, as Smith famously put it, in
explaining why bakers, brewers, butchers, and consumers seek
trade), nevertheless an economy can operate effectively only on
the basis of trust among different parties. When business
activities, including those of banks and other financial
institutions, generate the confidence that they can and will do
the things they pledge, then relations among lenders and
borrowers can go smoothly in a mutually supportive way. As Adam
Smith wrote:

When the people of any particular country have such confidence
in the fortune, probity, and prudence of a particular banker, as
to believe that he is always ready to pay upon demand such of
his promissory notes as are likely to be at any time presented
to him; those notes come to have the same currency as gold and
silver money, from the confidence that such money can at any
time be had for them.[1]
Smith explained why sometimes this did not happen, and he would
not have found anything particularly puzzling, I would suggest,
in the difficulties faced today by businesses and banks thanks
to the widespread fear and mistrust that is keeping credit
markets frozen and preventing a coordinated expansion of credit.
It is also worth mentioning in this context, especially since
the "welfare state" emerged long after Smith's own time, that in
his various writings, his overwhelming concern—and worry—about
the fate of the poor and the disadvantaged are strikingly
prominent. The most immediate failure of the market mechanism
lies in the things that the market leaves undone. Smith's
economic analysis went well beyond leaving everything to the
invisible hand of the market mechanism. He was not only a
defender of the role of the state in providing public services,
such as education, and in poverty relief (along with demanding
greater freedom for the indigents who received support than the
Poor Laws of his day provided), he was also deeply concerned
about the inequality and poverty that might survive in an
otherwise successful market economy.
Lack of clarity about the distinction between the necessity and
sufficiency of the market has been responsible for some
misunderstandings of Smith's assessment of the market mechanism
by many who would claim to be his followers. For example,
Smith's defense of the food market and his criticism of
restrictions by the state on the private trade in food grains
have often been interpreted as arguing that any state
interference would necessarily make hunger and starvation worse.
But Smith's defense of private trade only took the form of
disputing the belief that stopping trade in food would reduce
the burden of hunger. That does not deny in any way the need for
state action to supplement the operations of the market by
creating jobs and incomes (e.g., through work programs). If
unemployment were to increase sharply thanks to bad economic
circumstances or bad public policy, the market would not, on its
own, recreate the incomes of those who have lost their jobs. The
new unemployed, Smith wrote, "would either starve, or be driven
to seek a subsistence either by begging, or by the perpetration
perhaps of the greatest enormities," and "want, famine, and
mortality would immediately prevail...."[2] Smith rejects
interventions that exclude the market—but not interventions that
include the market while aiming to do those important things
that the market may leave undone.
Smith never used the term "capitalism" (at least so far as I
have been able to trace), but it would also be hard to carve out
from his works any theory arguing for the sufficiency of market
forces, or of the need to accept the dominance of capital. He
talked about the importance of these broader values that go
beyond profits in The Wealth of Nations, but it is in his first
book, The Theory of Moral Sentiments, which was published
exactly a quarter of a millennium ago in 1759, that he
extensively investigated the strong need for actions based on
values that go well beyond profit seeking. While he wrote that
"prudence" was "of all the virtues that which is most useful to
the individual," Adam Smith went on to argue that "humanity,
justice, generosity, and public spirit, are the qualities most
useful to others."[3]
Smith viewed markets and capital as doing good work within their
own sphere, but first, they required support from other
institutions—including public services such as schools—and
values other than pure profit seeking, and second, they needed
restraint and correction by still other institutions—e.g.,
well-devised financial regulations and state assistance to the
poor—for preventing instability, inequity, and injustice. If we
were to look for a new approach to the organization of economic
activity that included a pragmatic choice of a variety of public
services and well-considered regulations, we would be following
rather than departing from the agenda of reform that Smith
outlined as he both defended and criticized capitalism.
3.
Historically, capitalism did not emerge until new systems of law
and economic practice protected property rights and made an
economy based on ownership workable. Commercial exchange could
not effectively take place until business morality made
contractual behavior sustainable and inexpensive—not requiring
constant suing of defaulting contractors, for example.
Investment in productive businesses could not flourish until the
higher rewards from corruption had been moderated.
Profit-oriented capitalism has always drawn on support from
other institutional values.
The moral and legal obligations and responsibilities associated
with transactions have in recent years become much harder to
trace, thanks to the rapid development of secondary markets
involving derivatives and other financial instruments. A
subprime lender who misleads a borrower into taking unwise risks
can now pass off the financial assets to third parties—who are
remote from the original transaction. Accountability has been
badly undermined, and the need for supervision and regulation
has become much stronger.
And yet the supervisory role of government in the United States
in particular has been, over the same period, sharply curtailed,
fed by an increasing belief in the self-regulatory nature of the
market economy. Precisely as the need for state surveillance
grew, the needed supervision shrank. There was, as a result, a
disaster waiting to happen, which did eventually happen last
year, and this has certainly contributed a great deal to the
financial crisis that is plaguing the world today. The
insufficient regulation of financial activities has implications
not only for illegitimate practices, but also for a tendency
toward overspeculation that, as Adam Smith argued, tends to grip
many human beings in their breathless search for profits.
Smith called the promoters of excessive risk in search of
profits "prodigals and projectors"—which is quite a good
description of issuers of subprime mortgages over the past few
years. Discussing laws against usury, for example, Smith wanted
state regulation to protect citizens from the "prodigals and
projectors" who promoted unsound loans:
A great part of the capital of the country would thus be kept
out of the hands which were most likely to make a profitable and
advantageous use of it, and thrown into those which were most
likely to waste and destroy it.[4]
The implicit faith in the ability of the market economy to
correct itself, which is largely responsible for the removal of
established regulations in the United States, tended to ignore
the activities of prodigals and projectors in a way that would
have shocked Adam Smith.
The present economic crisis is partly generated by a huge
overestimation of the wisdom of market processes, and the crisis
is now being exacerbated by anxiety and lack of trust in the
financial market and in businesses in general—responses that
have been evident in the market reactions to the sequence of
stimulus plans, including the $787 billion plan signed into law
in February by the new Obama administration. As it happens,
these problems were already identified in the eighteenth century
by Smith, even though they have been neglected by those who have
been in authority in recent years, especially in the United
States, and who have been busy citing Adam Smith in support of
the unfettered market.
4.
While Adam Smith has recently been much quoted, even if not much
read, there has been a huge revival, even more recently, of John
Maynard Keynes. Certainly, the cumulative downturn that we are
observing right now, which is edging us closer to a depression,
has clear Keynesian features; the reduced incomes of one group
of persons has led to reduced purchases by them, in turn causing
a further reduction in the income of others.
However, Keynes can be our savior only to a very partial extent,
and there is a need to look beyond him in understanding the
present crisis. One economist whose current relevance has been
far less recognized is Keynes's rival Arthur Cecil Pigou, who,
like Keynes, was also in Cambridge, indeed also in Kings
College, in Keynes's time. Pigou was much more concerned than
Keynes with economic psychology and the ways it could influence
business cycles and sharpen and harden an economic recession
that could take us toward a depression (as indeed we are seeing
now). Pigou attributed economic fluctuations partly to
"psychological causes" consisting of
variations in the tone of mind of persons whose action controls
industry, emerging in errors of undue optimism or undue
pessimism in their business forecasts.[5]
It is hard to ignore the fact that today, in addition to the
Keynesian effects of mutually reinforced decline, we are
strongly in the presence of "errors of...undue pessimism." Pigou
focused particularly on the need to unfreeze the credit market
when the economy is in the grip of excessive pessimism:
Hence, other things being equal, the actual occurrence of
business failures will be more or less widespread, according [to
whether] bankers' loans, in the face of crisis of demands, are
less or more readily obtainable.[6]
Despite huge injections of fresh liquidity into the American and
European economies, largely from the government, the banks and
financial institutions have until now remained unwilling to
unfreeze the credit market. Other businesses also continue to
fail, partly in response to already diminished demand (the
Keynesian "multiplier" process), but also in response to fear of
even less demand in the future, in a climate of general gloom
(the Pigovian process of infectious pessimism).
One of the problems that the Obama administration has to deal
with is that the real crisis, arising from financial
mismanagement and other transgressions, has become many times
magnified by a psychological collapse. The measures that are
being discussed right now in Washington and elsewhere to
regenerate the credit market include bailouts—with firm
requirements that subsidized financial institutions actually
lend—government purchase of toxic assets, insurance against
failure to repay loans, and bank nationalization. (The last
proposal scares many conservatives just as private control of
the public money given to the banks worries people concerned
about accountability.) As the weak response of the market to the
administration's measures so far suggests, each of these
policies would have to be assessed partly for their impact on
the psychology of businesses and consumers, particularly in
America.
5.
The contrast between Pigou and Keynes is relevant for another
reason as well. While Keynes was very involved with the question
of how to increase aggregate income, he was relatively less
engaged in analyzing problems of unequal distribution of wealth
and of social welfare. In contrast, Pigou not only wrote the
classic study of welfare economics, but he also pioneered the
measurement of economic inequality as a major indicator for
economic assessment and policy.[7] Since the suffering of the
most deprived people in each economy—and in the world—demands
the most urgent attention, the role of supportive cooperation
between business and government cannot stop only with mutually
coordinated expansion of an economy. There is a critical need
for paying special attention to the underdogs of society in
planning a response to the current crisis, and in going beyond
measures to produce general economic expansion. Families
threatened with unemployment, with lack of medical care, and
with social as well as economic deprivation have been hit
particularly hard. The limitations of Keynesian economics to
address their problems demand much greater recognition.
A third way in which Keynes needs to be supplemented concerns
his relative neglect of social services—indeed even Otto von
Bismarck had more to say on this subject than Keynes. That the
market economy can be particularly bad in delivering public
goods (such as education and health care) has been discussed by
some of the leading economists of our time, including Paul
Samuelson and Kenneth Arrow. (Pigou too contributed to this
subject with his emphasis on the "external effects" of market
transactions, where the gains and losses are not confined only
to the direct buyers or sellers.) This is, of course, a
long-term issue, but it is worth noting in addition that the
bite of a downturn can be much fiercer when health care in
particular is not guaranteed for all.
For example, in the absence of a national health service, every
lost job can produce a larger exclusion from essential health
care, because of loss of income or loss of employment-related
private health insurance. The US has a 7.6 percent rate of
unemployment now, which is beginning to cause huge deprivation.
It is worth asking how the European countries, including France,
Italy, and Spain, that lived with much higher levels of
unemployment for decades, managed to avoid a total collapse of
their quality of life. The answer is partly the way the European
welfare state operates, with much stronger unemployment
insurance than in America and, even more importantly, with basic
medical services provided to all by the state.
The failure of the market mechanism to provide health care for
all has been flagrant, most noticeably in the United States, but
also in the sharp halt in the progress of health and longevity
in China following its abolition of universal health coverage in
1979. Before the economic reforms of that year, every Chinese
citizen had guaranteed health care provided by the state or the
cooperatives, even if at a rather basic level. When China
removed its counterproductive system of agricultural collectives
and communes and industrial units managed by bureaucracies, it
thereby made the rate of growth of gross domestic product go up
faster than anywhere else in the world. But at the same time,
led by its new faith in the market economy, China also abolished
the system of universal health care; and, after the reforms of
1979, health insurance had to be bought by individuals (except
in some relatively rare cases in which the state or some big
firms provide them to their employees and dependents). With this
change, China's rapid progress in longevity sharply slowed down.
This was problem enough when China's aggregate income was
growing extremely fast, but it is bound to become a much bigger
problem when the Chinese economy decelerates sharply, as it is
currently doing. The Chinese government is now trying hard to
gradually reintroduce health insurance for all, and the US
government under Obama is also committed to making health
coverage universal. In both China and the US, the rectifications
have far to go, but they should be central elements in tackling
the economic crisis, as well as in achieving long-term
transformation of the two societies.
6.
The revival of Keynes has much to contribute both to economic
analysis and to policy, but the net has to be cast much wider.
Even though Keynes is often seen as a kind of a "rebel" figure
in contemporary economics, the fact is that he came close to
being the guru of a new capitalism, who focused on trying to
stabilize the fluctuations of the market economy (and then again
with relatively little attention to the psychological causes of
business fluctuations). Even though Smith and Pigou have the
reputation of being rather conservative economists, many of the
deep insights about the importance of nonmarket institutions and
nonprofit values came from them, rather than from Keynes and his
followers.
A crisis not only presents an immediate challenge that has to be
faced. It also provides an opportunity to address long-term
problems when people are willing to reconsider established
conventions. This is why the present crisis also makes it
important to face the neglected long-term issues like
conservation of the environment and national health care, as
well as the need for public transport, which has been very badly
neglected in the last few decades and is also so far
sidelined—as I write this article—even in the initial policies
announced by the Obama administration. Economic affordability
is, of course, an issue, but as the example of the Indian state
of Kerala shows, it is possible to have state-guaranteed health
care for all at relatively little cost. Since the Chinese
dropped universal health insurance in 1979, Kerala—which
continues to have it—has very substantially overtaken China in
average life expectancy and in indicators such as infant
mortality, despite having a much lower level of per capita
income. So there are opportunities for poor countries as well.
But the largest challenges face the United States, which already
has the highest level of per capita expenditure on health among
all countries in the world, but still has a relatively low
achievement in health and has more than forty million people
with no guarantee of health care. Part of the problem here is
one of public attitude and understanding. Hugely distorted
perceptions of how a national health service works need to be
corrected through public discussion. For example, it is common
to assume that no one has a choice of doctors in a European
national health service, which is not at all the case.
There is, however, also a need for better understanding of the
options that exist. In US discussions of health reform, there
has been an overconcentration on the Canadian system—a system of
public health care that makes it very hard to have private
medical care—whereas in Western Europe the national health
services provide care for all but also allow, in addition to
state coverage, private practice and private health insurance,
for those who have the money and want to spend it this way. It
is not clear just why the rich who can freely spend money on
yachts and other luxury goods should not be allowed to spend it
on MRIs or CT scans instead. If we take our cue from Adam
Smith's arguments for a diversity of institutions, and for
accommodating a variety of motivations, there are practical
measures we can take that would make a huge difference to the
world in which we live.
The present economic crises do not, I would argue, call for a
"new capitalism," but they do demand a new understanding of
older ideas, such as those of Smith and, nearer our time, of
Pigou, many of which have been sadly neglected. What is also
needed is a clearheaded perception of how different institutions
actually work, and of how a variety of organizations—from the
market to the institutions of the state—can go beyond short-term
solutions and contribute to producing a more decent economic
world.
—February 25, 2009
Notes
[1] Adam Smith, An Inquiry into the Nature and Causes of the
Wealth of Nations, edited by R.H. Campbell and A.S. Skinner
(Clarendon Press, 1976), I, II.ii.28, p. 292.
[2] Smith, The Wealth of Nations, I, I.viii.26, p. 91.
[3] Adam Smith, The Theory of Moral Sentiments, edited by D.D.
Raphael and A.L. Macfie (Clarendon Press, 1976), pp. 189–190.
[4] Smith, The Wealth of Nations, I, II.iv.15, p. 357.
[5] A.C. Pigou, Industrial Fluctuations (London: Macmillan,
1929), p. 73.
[6] Pigou, Industrial Fluctuations, p. 96.
[7] A.C. Pigou, The Economics of Welfare (London: Macmillan,
1920). Current works on economic inequality, including the major
contributions of A.B. Atkinson, have been to a considerable
extent inspired by Pigou's pioneering initiative: see Atkinson,
Social Justice and Public Policy (MIT Press, 1983).
Amartya Sen is Lamont University Professor at Harvard. He
received the Nobel Prize in Economics in 1998. His most recent
book is Identity and Violence: The Illusion of Destiny. (March
2009)
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#96870 - 15 Mar 09 11:29 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Polisi Cepek]
Marmalade Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 18 Apr 08
Posts: 2471
Loc: Jak
TLDR
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#96871 - 15 Mar 09 11:38 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Marmalade]
Dilli Offline
Pujangga Besar

Registered: 26 Feb 06
Posts: 8044
Loc: Nearest Bar
Quoting: Marmalade
TLDR
x 2
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Menace to Sobriety


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#96887 - 15 Mar 09 16:34 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Dilli]
Marmalade Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 18 Apr 08
Posts: 2471
Loc: Jak
Short attention spans ru
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#96891 - 15 Mar 09 17:45 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Marmalade]
Polisi Cepek Offline
Member*

Registered: 17 Mar 07
Posts: 809
Loc: Di tengah hutan
Too Long, Don't Read?
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"Some people think I've been flogging my own sausage," he joked.

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#96893 - 15 Mar 09 18:39 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Polisi Cepek]
Dilli Offline
Pujangga Besar

Registered: 26 Feb 06
Posts: 8044
Loc: Nearest Bar
Didn't
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#96894 - 15 Mar 09 18:46 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Dilli]
Marmalade Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 18 Apr 08
Posts: 2471
Loc: Jak
BAS
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#96904 - 15 Mar 09 19:14 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Marmalade]
luludanlili Offline
Member+

Registered: 09 Mar 09
Posts: 37
Loc: jakarta, indonesia
I read it (half), it's tiring.
The truth is financial analyst been trained to see the lack of regulation as an opportunity to get cash. Not all analyst even understand about the derivative product. If it made analyst sick (especially me) how could an investor understand? At the end of the presentation, he will only ask, how much return?
To redefine capitalist, why bother recall Smith or Keynes, let them rest in peace.
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#96907 - 15 Mar 09 19:28 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Marmalade]
kenyeung Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 16 Apr 07
Posts: 2374
Loc: Indonesia
Summing up that dull article for those with short attention spans: There's an economic crisis, possibly even a depression. So should capitalism be dropped in favor of, er, neo-capitalism (perhaps with more state intervention/regulations in the free market)? Waffle, waffle, bollocks, rhubarb and flying custard. No, not really, capitalism is still the way to go.
The End.

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#96908 - 15 Mar 09 19:29 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: luludanlili]
Marmalade Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 18 Apr 08
Posts: 2471
Loc: Jak
Boring Adult Stuff
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#96910 - 15 Mar 09 19:31 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: kenyeung]
KuKuKaChu Moderator Offline
Pooh Bah

Registered: 09 Oct 05
Posts: 10790
Loc: Centre of the Universe
thanks for the time-saving abstract, ken!
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#96933 - 16 Mar 09 12:18 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: KuKuKaChu]
Piss Salon Offline
Pujangga Besar

Registered: 27 Jun 06
Posts: 4039
Loc: Jakpus
Couldn't even read that.
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#96946 - 16 Mar 09 13:37 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Dilli]
fred Offline
Member*

Registered: 26 Nov 08
Posts: 743
Loc: here and there
Quoting: Dilli
Didn't


Tried three times, fell asleep twice and nearly turned to booze the third.
The short version was better. cool
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#97004 - 18 Mar 09 11:17 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: fred]
Marmalade Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 18 Apr 08
Posts: 2471
Loc: Jak
Tried a Little Drink Required
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#97014 - 18 Mar 09 13:17 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Marmalade]
Clive Sinclair Offline
Member+

Registered: 19 Feb 09
Posts: 32
Loc: Jakarta
Economic afford ability is, of course, an issue, but as the example of the Indian state of Kerala shows, it is possible to have state-guaranteed health care for all at relatively little cost.

Read PC's piece and this is the only part i disagree with having personally visited Kerala recently to write about the health care system. I can assure you it is neither particularly good nor affordable
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Truth??? Yeah, that's what i heard him say

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#97021 - 18 Mar 09 14:18 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Clive Sinclair]
Dontpanic Offline
Member+

Registered: 16 Mar 09
Posts: 73
Loc: Badly confused
Um, sorry to interject (Or something similar) but what, prey, does this have in connection with the subject of this thread? That being our beloved crooked expat in Bali going by the name of Bellesomethingor other?
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#97022 - 18 Mar 09 14:36 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Dontpanic]
chewwyUK Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 14 Sep 06
Posts: 2392
Loc: Jakarta
nothing at all .... welcome to JakChat!
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Edited by Piss Salon
Edit Reason: taste

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#97029 - 18 Mar 09 16:14 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: chewwyUK]
Dontpanic Offline
Member+

Registered: 16 Mar 09
Posts: 73
Loc: Badly confused
Quoting: chewwyUK
nothing at all .... welcome to jakchat!


OK that's now cleared up then. Glad I got that out of my system.
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#97031 - 18 Mar 09 16:26 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Dontpanic]
kenyeung Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 16 Apr 07
Posts: 2374
Loc: Indonesia
Getting firmly back on topic, I think the A-Team went really downhill in Series 5 when they got caught and started working for the military.

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#97034 - 18 Mar 09 16:38 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: kenyeung]
chewwyUK Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 14 Sep 06
Posts: 2392
Loc: Jakarta
I aint gett'n in no plane FOOL!

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Edited by Piss Salon
Edit Reason: taste

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#97035 - 18 Mar 09 17:47 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: chewwyUK]
Dontpanic Offline
Member+

Registered: 16 Mar 09
Posts: 73
Loc: Badly confused
Sorry I spoke! But what about our fine fucking feathered friend in Bali? Has he not deserved to be topped by the CIA as a cost effective way of avoiding extradition and prosecution? Or has he lived again to rip-off more widows, orphans and retired pensioners living in Bali?


Edited by Dontpanic (18 Mar 09 17:52)
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#97036 - 18 Mar 09 17:55 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Dontpanic]
Dontpanic Offline
Member+

Registered: 16 Mar 09
Posts: 73
Loc: Badly confused
BTW, should.t that be Ken Yang?
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#97037 - 18 Mar 09 17:58 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Dontpanic]
KuKuKaChu Moderator Offline
Pooh Bah

Registered: 09 Oct 05
Posts: 10790
Loc: Centre of the Universe
he's still active, as far as i know. but his financiers may be backing away from him.
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KuKuKaChu: dangerously too sophisticated

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#97040 - 18 Mar 09 18:19 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Dontpanic]
kenyeung Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 16 Apr 07
Posts: 2374
Loc: Indonesia

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#97041 - 18 Mar 09 18:26 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: kenyeung]
kenyeung Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 16 Apr 07
Posts: 2374
Loc: Indonesia
Of course, singers have been doing cameos in popular TV shows for a long time. Long before Boy George appeared in the A-Team, Mama Cass showed up in Scooby Doo.


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#97042 - 18 Mar 09 18:34 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Dontpanic]
kenyeung Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 16 Apr 07
Posts: 2374
Loc: Indonesia
Quoting: Dontpanic
BTW, should.t that be Ken Yang?


No, it should not. And if you're looking to buy or sell real estate, you'll find I'm a lot more honest than Mr Bellefontaine:


Edited by Dilli (19 Mar 09 05:50)
Edit Reason: Website

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#97045 - 18 Mar 09 19:11 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: kenyeung]
Dontpanic Offline
Member+

Registered: 16 Mar 09
Posts: 73
Loc: Badly confused
Canada , Eh? Well aboot that I don't know. But in Indonesian bahasa , Kenyang means satisfied As in full stomach or well,.. Ken Yang would be a good play on words. Hence the question about Ken Yeung. No offence meant. I'm sure you're more honest that our friend Harry/Larry, but then that's a given. And no offense meant by that either. But then, who would want to live in the frozen North when God gave us Bali? But no offence meant. But then it's all aboot investment and money. But I;ve made mine so am happy in the sun. No offence meant. Harry/Barry is an asshole by any standards and it pisses me off to see him strutting around Bali like he owns the fucking place after having ripped off widows and orphans.


Edited by Dontpanic (18 Mar 09 19:18)
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#97145 - 21 Mar 09 08:15 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Dontpanic]
The Great Gonzo Offline
Member+

Registered: 13 Dec 06
Posts: 134
Loc: Big Durian
I can't believe someone is questioning Ken's authenticity!

Don't you know he is the brother to Bolo Yeung?


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"Oh, you're not so bad yourself, Cockface. Where are you two from? Nose City?"

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#97169 - 21 Mar 09 14:39 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: The Great Gonzo]
Piss Salon Offline
Pujangga Besar

Registered: 27 Jun 06
Posts: 4039
Loc: Jakpus
The Great Gonzo returns! How are tricks mate?
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place within us love that truly gives, tenderness that truly unites, self-offering that tells the truth and does not deceive, forgiveness that truly receives, loving physical union that welcomes

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#108878 - 03 Mar 10 16:14 Re: Barry "Lawrence" Bellefontaine: Bule Crook living in Bali [Re: Piss Salon]
Riibond Offline
Member+

Registered: 08 Jan 10
Posts: 78
Loc: jakarta
Nice info man ! smile
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money is for now
Wisdom and knowledge for the future



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