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#47126 - 09 Mar 07 11:12 Re: Garuda Crash in Jogja [Re: KuKuKaChu]
KuKuKaChu Moderator Offline
Pooh Bah

Registered: 09 Oct 05
Posts: 10790
Loc: Centre of the Universe
correction, the plane bounced twice on the runway.
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#47127 - 09 Mar 07 13:15 Re: Garuda Crash in Jogja [Re: KuKuKaChu]
Capt. Mainwaring Offline
Pujangga Besar

Registered: 16 Aug 06
Posts: 3225
Loc: here
KuKu , you don't , you surely don't mean , that a lot of bullshit is being spouted yet again ?

Without a doubt the thing hit the runway very hard indeed - as you mention there are no witness marks from tortured rubber , and must have come down nose first , even though the normal trim at this point would have been nose up 4 degrees - it is absolutely forbidden for a pilot to push the nose down to gain airspeed in the event of power failure - but who knows what you do when you lose an engine at low altitude . Many reasons why they could have lost an engine , bird strike ,perhaps caused by a javanese chicken with bird flu (ayam sorry) , incorrect fuel readings from the wing tanks (737's were noted for this one) .



I wonder what the next round of speculation will be ?

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I also made a vegetarian version,with tempe and tofu chunks for myself and others.Get over it.
Kosong.Wolo.Setunggal.Setunggal.Setunggal.Kosong.Pitu.Setunggal.Kosong.Wolo=Tempik

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#47128 - 09 Mar 07 13:17 Re: Garuda Crash in Jogja [Re: doremi]
Capt. Mainwaring Offline
Pujangga Besar

Registered: 16 Aug 06
Posts: 3225
Loc: here
Quoting: nwgirl
Just a wild idea (just may be)...possibility of suicide killer?
knowing that there were lots of Australians inside. My imagination is running wild now.


An extremely wild idea - if it was a suicide killer , he or she wasn't very good was he ?
_________________________
I also made a vegetarian version,with tempe and tofu chunks for myself and others.Get over it.
Kosong.Wolo.Setunggal.Setunggal.Setunggal.Kosong.Pitu.Setunggal.Kosong.Wolo=Tempik

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#47129 - 09 Mar 07 13:27 Re: Garuda Crash in Jogja [Re: Capt. Mainwaring]
Capt. Mainwaring Offline
Pujangga Besar

Registered: 16 Aug 06
Posts: 3225
Loc: here
I had considered posting American Airlines stats , but you would have run out of space on the server - how is this for a load of chop-suey - and you can guarantee that there are loads unreported

[edit: and there were about 100 incidents among airlines in China, which can be viewed at the website above]


Edited by riccardo (12 Mar 07 02:10)
Edit Reason: sorta long

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#47272 - 12 Mar 07 02:03 Re: Garuda Crash in Jogja [Re: Capt. Mainwaring]
riccardo Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 12 Oct 05
Posts: 2195
Loc: Jakarta
Investigation Updates.

MARCH 11, ALLEGATIONS of possible mechanical failure in the crash of Garuda flight GA-200 emerged yesterday with news the plane's braking system failed one day before it crash landed.
The malfunction, while landing at Soekarno-Hatta Airport in Jakarta on Tuesday, provides a new line of inquiry into the crash that killed 21 people, including five Australians.

Pilot error has so far loomed large as the reason behind Wednesday's disaster.

THE Indonesian government announced a snap audit of Garuda's operations.

The Aussie investigators in Canberra studying the data on the black boxes should have a preliminary explanation of the cause in the next 2 or 3 days...


This is the latest that is being publicly reported:
-----------

MARCH 10, THE nosewheel of the ill-fated Garuda jet, which crashed this week, was found at the beginning of the runway, indicating that it broke off on impact and well before the plane bounced and skidded off the end of the airstrip.
One of the Indonesian investigators working on the cause of the crash said, however, that a pilot should still be able to stop the plane despite the loss of the wheel.

Joseph Tumenggung, an air safety investigator from the National Transportation Safety Committee, said the cockpit voice recorder would be vitally important to determining exactly what went wrong.

But the investigation had ruled out any suggestion of an "unlawful act" - that is, sabotage. It was also certain now that there was no fire before the plane came to a grinding halt in a rice paddy.

Mr Tumenggung said the fire which engulfed the plane was entirely from its fuel combusting. He believed this too was responsible for the fact that the plane's right wing had ended up on top of the left wing.

It seemed that the fuel line under the wing had exploded, sending the wing into the air and flipping over the plane to the other side.

Mr Tumenggung, who has examined the wreckage at the scene, said he concluded this based on the fact that there was no abrasion marks indicating it had slid.

Meanwhile, the investigation team has now moved the pilot, co-pilot and crew members out of the air force hospital where they were being held to an undisclosed location.

The chief of the military hospital, air force major and doctor Djunady said the two pilots and four crew members were not seriously hurt but the pilot was suffering depression and guilt.

However, Dr Djunady denied pilot Muhammad Marwoto Komar, 45, was suicidal.
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#47281 - 12 Mar 07 04:43 Re: Garuda Crash in Jogja [Re: riccardo]
riccardo Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 12 Oct 05
Posts: 2195
Loc: Jakarta
An excerpt from the Smh.com.au site:

Amid claims that pilot error caused the crash, Captain Komar and the rest of the crew have been imprisoned by police at the local air force hospital.

He was suicidal, Captain Stephanus said. "We are very afraid he could kill himself.

"The captain is very depressed; he is feeling very, very guilty."

Describing Wednesday's crash as a "freak incident", Captain Stephanus urged the public not to pre-judge the pilot, pointing towards the claims of a downdraft and the possible flap malfunction. There have also been questions asked about the condition of the 15-year-old plane.

Some Indonesian investigators are convinced Komar is at fault for coming in too fast. Australian and Indonesian police have joined the investigation, which has prompted a behind-the-scenes turf war over jurisdiction.

Air safety officials believe they should be conducting the inquiry and are angered by the description of it by the Australian Federal Police Commissioner, Mick Keelty, as a "police investigation", and revealing the pilot's claims of a downdraft forcing the accident.
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Just here proffering my pearls to swine, my throat to wolves and my trousers to the flagpole.

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#47299 - 12 Mar 07 23:19 Re: Garuda Crash in Jogja [Re: riccardo]
riccardo Offline
Pujangga

Registered: 12 Oct 05
Posts: 2195
Loc: Jakarta
Excerpts from AP newswire:

-----------------------

Rajasa said after special prayers Friday for the safety of the world's most populous Muslim-majority nation that key recommendations on transport were due in the coming week. He did not give an exact date.

The Yogyakarta accident "reinforces the view that the culture of safety is almost non-existent in Indonesia," said Shukor Yusof, an aviation analyst with Standard and Poor's equity research in Singapore.

"There is a long list of disasters in the air, at sea and on land, a large number of which are the result of negligence and an attitude of ignoring safety procedures and prevention," Indonesia's Koran Tempo said in an editorial.

The string of air and maritime disasters have killed hundreds of people and shaken confidence in the transport links that bind this archipelago nation of 17,000 islands.

Major recent air and sea disasters include:

- September 5, 2005: A Mandala Airlines Boeing 737 crashed on the island of Sumatra, killing 150 people.

- Last December 29, a passenger ferry carrying some 600 people sank in the Java Sea, with more than 350 dead or missing.

- On New Year's Day, an Adam Air Boeing 737 vanished off Sulawesi with the 102 passengers and crew now presumed dead. Its black box recorders were found on the ocean floor.

- On February 22, a ferry caught fire off Jakarta. The search for survivors was called off earlier this month with 54 confirmed dead and 23 missing.

Experts blame old, badly maintained planes and ships and lax safety for the death toll.

Vice President Jusuf Kalla said that the Garuda tragedy was embarrassing for Indonesia. "Of course we are embarrassed to be a country with a high rate of accidents," he said.
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Just here proffering my pearls to swine, my throat to wolves and my trousers to the flagpole.

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#63669 - 22 Oct 07 14:06 Re: Garuda Crash in Jogja [Re: riccardo]
KuKuKaChu Moderator Offline
Pooh Bah

Registered: 09 Oct 05
Posts: 10790
Loc: Centre of the Universe
From ABC News

Garuda crash report slams pilots, airline

By Indonesia correspondent Geoff Thompson

The final report on the crash of a Garuda plane in Indonesia earlier this year has delivered scathing criticism of the pilots and airline regulators.

Five Australians were among the 21 people killed when Garuda flight 200 crash-landed in March.

The final report on the crash has strongly condemned the pilot in charge for flying too fast for the plane's wing-flaps to be operated properly.

The pilot in charge of Garuda flight 200 did not follow company procedures and make a stabilised approach to the runway in Yogyakarta on the day of the accident.

He was also criticised for not aborting the landing and going around when alerts sounded 15 times, as well as the copilot screaming to the chief pilot to go around when the aircraft first bounced off the runway.

The copilot was also criticised for not taking control of the aircraft when it was clear the landing conditions were unsafe.

Indonesia's Director General of Civil Aviation was also criticised for not identifying deficiencies in the pilot's training.
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